Friday, February 21, 2014

The Conundrum of Excellence

Nnamdi Asomugha's retirement has been nagging me every since he announced it. Now, as we approach the 2014 draft, I think I know why.

Nnamdi was perhaps our only elite player of the non-kicker variety in 10 years. Or so we thought. 

As soon as he left the Raiders, he faltered, and then completely flamed out, and has now given up the game at a time when he's still five years younger than Charles Woodson. And that's the best player we've produced in 10 years? It's depressing. 

How cruelly ironic that a team whose motto is Commitment to Excellence has been so lacking in it...

Anyhow, onward to the draft discussion...

Look who has the first five draft slots this year: Texans, Rams, Jaguars, Browns and Raiders. 

What do all of these teams have in common? Grease fires at the quarterback position.

The other four teams have more genuinely established playmakers than the Raiders: The Texans have Andre Johnson, the Rams have a great pass rush, the Jaguars have MJD, the Browns have Josh Gordon...But without solid play at quarterback, they all suck.

Now look at the five teams picking last: Seahawks, Broncos, Patriots, Niners, Panthers. The common thread isn't hard to find there: franchise quarterbacks.

I'm not saying that a great defense and elite skill players are immaterial. Far from it, given what we saw in the playoffs and Super Bowl this year. 

But I am saying that a franchise quarterback is the surest, most efficient tool for executing a turnaround. 

Who's the best receiver out there? Megatron, or Josh Gordon or Dez Bryant. All sitting home for the playoffs. The best running back? Adrian Peterson or LeSean McCoy? The Vikings are flailing, the Eagles were one and done in the playoffs. The Falcons gave up a king's ransom for Julio Jones, and he's damn good. But where has it gotten him? 

We don't have to draft a quarterback in the first round, as long as the best quarterback isn't in the first round. We need to identify and GET the best quarterback, whether that means trading up or sitting back. That has to be priority number one, doesn't it? 

The bottom line is that we need excellence on the Raiders. It's high time. There's a lot of money to spend, and a full draft ahead. We need a franchise quarterback, and some real playmakers. No more excuses. Reggie needs to rock this offseason. Here we go...


Blogger nyraider said...

We still need all the pieces, QB included. But I'm sure most agree that selecting the right QB is more important than selecting "a" QB. That said, perhaps this isn't the year the Raiders find a franchise QB. The available talent pool looks pretty thin.

I'd be on board with this:
QB Michael Vick
1st rd pick: G Greg Robinson
2nd rd pick: DT Aaron Donald

The Raiders could do a lot worse... and they usually do.

5:05 PM  
Blogger Calico Jack said...

I'm not convinced there is an franchise-type QB in the draft this year.

I would be more inclined to piggy-back on NYR post but would consider Jason Campbell over Vick.

My hope is that we can secure a QB in the later rounds of the draft that has the upside and intangible to become our #1.

5:19 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I would like to have Kirk Cousins, but who knows he might be a Matt Flyn type of QB!? But anyways, I believe Championships are won by defenses!!

So Take who would you pick as your QB of choice? Or what moves would you make as a GM??

7:18 PM  
Blogger Raider Take said...

Anon, you know which QB I'd pick? The right one. Or I'd get fired. So that makes me just like Reggie, without the salary.

There has to be ONE quarterback in this draft who is better than what we have, and better than who's available via trade. That's the guy we need to get.

It's easy to say that there's no franchise QB out there this year. Yet Kaepernick and Wilson fell to the 2nd and 3rd rounds. Who knew?

There's a shrewd pick out there somewhere, and it's time for the RAIDERS to be ahead of the curve.

If Reggie and Allen don't start excelling in the shrewd department, they're gone, and we'll be wondering why we didn't go after Lovie Smith.

Expect greatness and you just might get it. Don't expect it, and you never will.

8:22 PM  
Blogger Calico Jack said...

There is a huge difference from identifying a QB better than what we have and a "franchise" QB.

Would anyone argue that Campbell isn't an upgrade?

Often times the QB in the weeds which are the exceptions (Brady, Wilson, Kap) joins a team that is already playoff caliber.

I personally don't follow the college game but if there is a QB that McK/DA are excited about, I don't care what round the player is drafted.

8:37 PM  
Blogger Raider Take said...

I agree about the round. Doesn't matter. What matters is getting the right guy.

But I've got to think that between Maznziel, Bortles, Bridgewater and others, there's one who's going to be pretty darned good in the NFL.

Campbell, McCown, Vick and possibly Cousins would be an upgrade over what we have.

But wouldn't that just be back to the 'retread' future for the Raiders? Heck, two of them already started for the Raiders.

It's increasingly unsettling how the "new" Raiders look like the old Raiders. I tell you, if we blow all of this available money and don't get a lot of excellence from it, then we're really gonna look like the old Raiders.

8:50 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"It's easy to say that there's no franchise QB out there this year. Yet Kaepernick and Wilson fell to the 2nd and 3rd rounds. Who knew?" Well read the article links below!

and this one

So yea the old regime almost had it but just slipped away. Oh well. Besides I still believe that both Kapernick and Wilson are unproven (forget that one is a champ now) and are products of major success in due to their DEFENSES!

So anyways Take answer my question already and don't take the easy way out by saying it's not your job to make the right QB pick!?!?

9:36 PM  
Blogger Raider Take said...

Anon, I could make a pretend bold pick and say Manziel or Bortles, but it's meaningless, and it's not my job.

Pay me a half million, send me to Indy for the Combine, give me access to player interviews and Wonderlics and a scouting department, then maybe I'd have a better sense.

Not my job. Reggie's job. He's got one draft and one offseason to turn the corner.

If he doesn't, he gets fired. And then maybe I'll apply for the job.

10:12 PM  
Anonymous JONES said...

"Reggie's job. He's got one draft and one offseason to turn the corner."....

That is not written in stone. Take, you were screaming at the end of the season that Allen probably wouldn't be back if he went 4-12. Your ultimatums are useless too.

It all depends how it shakes out, they could go 6-10 and still be back for more. It depends on what is happening, if it is a train wreck, then yes FIRED. If it's showing improvement and progress, doesn't mean they will be fired. You act as if you know Mark Davis and what he is thinking. You even used quotes from 2 seasons ago as proof that Mark has an itchy trigger finger.

Hysteria isn't needed at this time. Rational thought and solid moves are needed, not high tension and panic. Good thing you aren't the GM, you would definitely pull the trigger too soon and blow it up.


10:32 PM  
Blogger Raider Take said...

I don't know Mark Davis, but I guarantee you, if it takes this regime three years to finally win two less games than Hue Jackson after another full draft and $50 million to spend, then they're gone, gone, gone.

10:38 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I know it's meaningless since none of us works in any level of Raiders organization. But we all partTAKE in discussion in trying to figure out what maybe is the best choice or scenarios for our Raiders team. It is why we come here and pretend to make those "bold" picks? But I guess you choose not to part Take in that manner?? Weak sauce man...

10:49 PM  
Blogger Raider Take said...

Well, based on what I've seen, which isn't much, Bortles and Bridgewater don't excite me. Manziel concerns me in matters of maturity and size, but he could be electric, and I like his swagger, so put me down for Manziel. Maybe there's a lurker out there who'll fall to the second or third round, but I haven't done the research. What else do you want me to say? You may forget, I've been doing this since 2005. I'm worn out waiting for the Raiders to get it right. It's time.

11:02 PM  
Blogger nyraider said...

IMO, if the top 3-4 prospects don't make the grade, look for the middle to late round sleeper(s) and stack the QB position. Let the best man win the job. Maybe McGloin will surprise us.

7:16 AM  
Blogger nyraider said...

News the Raiders can use:

Greg Robinson having an impressive Combine w/4.88 sec 40-yard dash and 32 presses of 225 lbs. Not that anymore info is needed to make this guy our first pick if he falls to #5.

Eric Decker reported by GM Elway to be hitting the free agent market. At any reasonable price, Decker would be a huge upgrade at WR for the Raiders.

8:57 AM  
Anonymous JONES said...

You don't know that, Take. You said Allen was GONE GONE GONE after this year.

Remember they are in the toughest division now, unlike when your hero Hue was in Oakland. Toughest schedule, toughest division....injuries could pop up again, many things could happen that would not be CAUSE for dismissal.

What I would dislike, if Mark Davis thinks like you, Take. Assess the situation and take it under context before making a judgment is what I want from Mark Davis. Not a rule book that says, DOESN'T matter, it says in this book that you have 3 years and if you don't have the playoffs by then = FIRED. It's much better to be right at the MOMENT.....instead of relying on some sort of written in stone philosophy. Al Davis used to live by that Motto and I agree with it.


9:14 AM  
Blogger Calico Jack said...

Agree NYR. Stack the QB position. I think it would be good business to sign a veteran QB plus take a QB in the draft. Why not have 4 QBs competing for #1 and a job on the roster?

4:41 PM  
Blogger nyraider said...

Are we already qualifying lack of success in 2014 with extenuating circumstances? Didn't they just play the extenuating circumstances card in 2013?

My personal view is the Raiders need to show significant improvement in 2014 for me to stay connected to Allen, and perhaps McKenzie too.

Three years is a long time in the NFL, and 13 years is an eternity.

5:54 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

RT my man

Please Bridgewater is a way better prospect than Manziel. I live in fLorida seen Bridgewater all the way since high school he will be at least an above average pro and possibly a long term guy.

Since I live in Florida I also see every sec game. Manziel was a great college football player and awesome athlete. However, I don't think it will translate to the NFL nearly as well.

The number one priority in the nfl today is to be able to throw the ball down the field from the pocket. With the rule changes the physical freak athletes on the field its mandatory if you want to win.

Bridgewater can throw down the field from the pocket, Manziel can not.

Manziel reminds me of Flutie

6:06 PM  
Anonymous JONES said...

I'm saying that the team could play it's best brand of ball since 2002 and still go 6-10. This isn't your avg rebuild or division and acting as if it is, well, I won't write it.

You can thank the last regime for the gigantic pit that this team has had to try and crawl out of. If you didn't notice, the 1st 2 years of the new regime wasn't in a position to start a rebuild in the conventional sense.

I want to see them moving forward and at a decent pace this off season. I want a quality team showing up on Sundays during the Reg season. Build on that and I would be happy....I demand this and I demand that = what a joke.

Wait for some moves to be made before you start jumping all over it, you can tell some just can't wait to pounce on a move and beat it to death. Just like the Flynn "debacle", still pointing at that and saying how pathetic McKenzie is..... It ain't a quick fix, the hole was too deep...accept it and move on.


10:08 PM  
Blogger nyraider said...

I think the point is that time for excuses is over. I don't think the clock starts now. I think it's been running and we've already acknowledged and given a pass for the delays attributable to mistakes of the past regime.

Raiders can't afford to draft another JaMarcus Russell, or even another Darren McFadden. Moves made now will determine if the Raiders field a better team in 2014. The results should be clearly evident on the field in 2014.

8:02 AM  
Blogger Raider Take said...

Three years ago, the Broncos at 8-8 under Tebow won this division.

This division became hard only recently, and it's because the other teams got their act together. The Broncos, Chargers and Chiefs all showed marked improvement and playoff contention immediately after cleaning house in the coaching and executive ranks.

In terms of expectations, the Raiders under Reggie seem to have been granted a TWO YEAR pass over these other teams in terms of getting their competitive act together. Or is it now three years? Four years? Because the division is hard?

Aim higher.

8:09 AM  
Anonymous JONES said...

Oh man, you guys have no clue, as usual. 3 years ago did their owner die? Did their owner do everything? Did their owner leave the franchise in shambles? The Raiders have a long road to get their act together and it isn't the fault of this regime. It isn't excuses, this is the reality.

You guys can go on and on about Hue and 8-8 and the other teams turning it around fast, Doesn't change the FACT that the Raiders had to redo the whole damn thing. AND, they had to start with no assets and little draft picks. I don't expect a division win with the 3 other teams making the playoffs this year.

Raiders don't even have a roster yet and you clowns are popping off with ultimatums. You guys don't understand the depth and you probably never will.

Take, you claim THAT IS REGGIE's JOB. Then you tell ME to aim higher? WTF does it matter what you or I or anyone else on these boards AIM? It's up to Reggie to aim, I'm just commenting on what is seen. What is seen is a franchise NOW able to START this turn around. They have a ton of cap space and a wide open roster. Other teams in the division have solid rosters ALREADY and have played together for a few years. I would say that this is a big advantage for them.

You guys are setting yourselves up for more letdown, over these past 2 years, it has become apparent that this is a very huge task. Something never seen in pro sports before. It was like a new, starting franchise without the League allowing for an expansion draft. Now they can actually sign players to more than just 1 year. The building has begun, but it will take time, FACT OF LIFE, get over it.


Setting a time table that is unrealistic is for the dummies...enjoy.

9:14 AM  
Blogger nyraider said...

I agree to the uniqueness of the situation; however, I think the perennial free pass has expired. The Raiders have a full compliment of draft picks out of the #5 slot, and ample cap space. They will have many returning players in 2014, and management and coaching remains essentially unchanged.

So why should we maintain low expectations?

2:20 PM  
Anonymous JONES said...

I'm not saying they have a free pass, am I?

Yes, there should be much improvement if Reggie/Allen does his job. All 3 teams made the playoffs, maybe the Raiders will be better than S.D., don't see them surpassing KC and Den though.

There can be much improvement on the team, just sayin there is a chance that it may not hit that magic 8-8 you guys want so badly next year. Many factors that still go against the Raiders next year, but yes, there should definitely be improvement.


5:00 PM  
Anonymous Rick Wascher said...

There is a limit to the rebuild time. Mark Davis was reluctant to give any asst. coaches 2 year contracts. Makes it easier to clean house at the end of the year, without paying coaches who are not here. We need a veteran QB and a 2nd round guy like Garrapolo to groom. If you keep a pocket passer, keep MM for the backup. A scrambler like Bortles or Garrapolo, then keep TP so the OC doesn't have to keep changing game-plans.

5:16 PM  
Blogger OakTownBlues said...

One thing is for certain. 2016, and not a day sooner, will this organization break .500.

Predicting personnel is foolish from our perspective. How they mesh is most important. You can have the best freaking QB in the world, I mean, just look at the Super Bowl vs. Gruden.

They did not win that game.

Callahan Lost It.

With great players, he changed the plan because the LEADERSHIP SUCKED.

Why was Denver decent with a guy like Tebow? Strong Leadership.

Why have all these other teams done so well too... the talent?


the play calling?


If you have just a little life experience and a little football experience, you know for sure that tyhe best PREPARED and most ORGANIZED team beats talent hands down.

The Raiders SUCK not because the players are less competent, but because they were so poorly led.

Keep on looking to your crystal balls, people. I stopped the name game years ago, and am happier for it, because I watch with unjaded eyeballs and a clear head.

The Raiders are losing because it is the culture.

That can change.

In 2016.

3:17 AM  
Blogger OakTownBlues said...

Take, excellent take. I don't mean to be redundant, but the fix is easier than I thing most of us would agree to believe. (OakTown reclines and sighs, looking forward to the Seattle rematch with Frisco, while the "A-Team" gets it act together).

I call Clown Car by game 5! (but then, the gel will thicken)... The Autumn Wind ALWAYS starts as a Summer Breeze.

You just watch...

3:29 AM  
Anonymous Raider Nate 75 said...

"Three years ago, the Broncos at 8-8 under Tebow won this division.

This division became hard only recently, and it's because the other teams got their act together. The Broncos, Chargers and Chiefs all showed marked improvement and playoff contention immediately after cleaning house in the coaching and executive ranks."

That's easy to say about the other divisional teams and their crappy records, as they were only a few key players away from making things happen. The Chargers still need a solid running game to balance Rivers (an above average QB).
The Doncos and Chiefs needed a solid QB starting. They both got their QBs in Manning and Alex Smith. All 3 teams had solid, above average defenses, and all 3 teams had excellent O-Lines.
Again, I go back to the point that drafting or signing any QB at this point is mute if we do not establish the lines on both sides of the ball. We have the money to do it this year. I think a Rookie QB is not going to fair much better than Pryor nor McGloin. I think if we go after a QB it should be a vet (I'm all for Campbell, Cousins but only if he's cut). I'm not for bringing in Vick.
If we draft a QB, go later rounds. Get a solid passer and smart QB. Jimmy Garopolo is still my favorite in the draft. Aj McCarron, Bridgewater, Jeff Matthews, or Derek Carr are a few QB's I'd be happy with (in that order too).
But I feel, and have for the last 10 years, that both o and d lines need help. We have not had a solid O-line captain since Barrett Robbins; and nobody on the current roster is even close to being as cerebral as he was. We need a Center to be the captain, and I'm not sold on the Wiz in that spot. Build the O-line and D-line. That has to be priority!
Manning is nothing without a o-line (Super Bowl proved that). Neither is any other flamboyant QB.
After the lines, get help at WRs, CB, and RB; and use the draft to do it.

10:06 AM  
Anonymous Raider Nate 75 said...

The Raiders have re-signed Tawain Jones for 3 years, $4.55 million. Really? I know he excelled on Special Teams (not as a returner I might add) and we are going to pay him this much?
I hope they have something else in mind.

2:54 PM  
Blogger nyraider said...

Jones actually made progress as a CB last year. He's a good tackler, and he has closing speed. So he's a legit backup RB and CB as well as being a standout ST player. You can bet another team would have signed him if he became available.

3:49 PM  
Blogger Raider Take said...

Nate, I'm not saying that the Raiders should have been able to execute a one-year turnaround like the others...

But how about spotting the Raiders a couple of extra years and expecting a three-year turnaround? Is that too much to ask? Is there a scenario where six wins this year is acceptable, as some have suggested?

4:43 PM  
Anonymous JONES said...

Nothing wrong with that price for a top Special Teams player. Look at what a punter was getting paid? Consistent Gunners are not easy to come by....nothing wrong with that signing at all.

1.5 Mill a year is peanuts and JONES has a very low cap hit...told ya that some will jump at anything and beat it to death. Didn't think it would be a JONES signing though.


6:45 PM  
Blogger Calico Jack said...

Turnaround in 2014 should be expected with the cap resources and draft picks.

What constitutes a 'turnaround' is truly in the eye of the beholder.

For me, it is a vastly improved roster (talent, depth), a more competitive edge, and more wins.

In what I consider the 1st year of the true rebuild, my baseline is 8 wins.

When the 2014 season is concluded, I want to be confident, excited, and chomping at the bit for the 2015 season to begin because of what I saw on the playing field in 2014.

I want to have that same feeling as when the 1999 finished when in your heart and mind, you know full well that the Raiders are on to something -- where the future is filled with REAL hope, promise, and optimism.

10:01 PM  
Anonymous Raider Nate 75 said...

I'm feeling this season they do need the one season turn around.

For me, we were competitive and in every game last season but 2. I blame a lot on the coaches because of a lack of adjusting the game plan in the second half (mostly). They would take a lead, and then play the 2nd half not to lose.

There had better be vast improvement this next season; meaning we should win 8+ games. We were right there, and I feel if we had some aggressive coaching, we would have won 6-8 games this past season. So for me, the vast improvement will not only be roster, but the coaches being aggressive in their scheme and how they play call.

I do think they need some improvement/play-makers on the roster, but mostly in the o and d lines. The coaches and RM complained toward the end of the season that they didn't have the depth to be as aggressive with their game planning as they wanted to be. Well, here's your chance to get the roster and players you want, but I better see the fire in the coaching as well; that will translate into a drastic change in our team this next season. We better be in the playoffs; I will not settle for less this next season.

9:38 AM  
Anonymous JONES said...

Nate said...."I will not settle for less this next season."

And if they don't? LOL. That's right, you will be right back to where you are now, next season, right? LOL.

Threats, ultimatums...tough talk and you sat through record losing with the last regime, this one though, better create miracles or else, LMAO. I'm sure Reggie is shaking in his boots when he reads this stuff.


9:55 AM  
Anonymous Raider00 said...

"Did their owner leave the franchise in shambles?"

Jones. Very good at revising history.

When Al Davis died, Raiders were on way to playoffs.

Many young players were doing well.

We all thought, Mcfadden, Moore, Valdheer, McClain, Bush, were a great foundation.

But then, after Davis died, Jason Campbell got hurt.

Panic set in, and the crazy Carson Palmer trade was made.

And it was the Palmer trade, I believe, that left Raiders in shambles.

Since Davis" death, all the young players, with the exception of Valdheer, have regressed.

So Davis left behind an 8-8 team. A playoff team, if Campbells stays healthy.

Davis also would have had a full draft in 2012. Instead of Raiders having no draft in 2012.

Because if Davis had lived, no way he makes the terrible Palmer deal.

12:46 PM  
Anonymous JONES said...

Oh, talk about revising history. It was in shambles and if you can't see that, I pity you.

They were 7-4 after playing 6 of their division games. Mr Davis passed and the team lost any momentum, Hue went berserk and he lost them. The team got thrashed in Miami and Green Bay and they couldn't recover....that was the best they had, a mediocre team, in a mediocre division that peaked after half a season.....

Hue Jackson said it himself after the last game vs S.D. He said that changes needed to be made, that these players didn't have the heart etc.... So are you saying Hue didn't know what he was talking about?

Al Davis did everything, his health was not good, he left the team in shambles, that is an indisputable fact. To say they were a playoff team when they lost to a team with Tebow as their QB...come on man, that's freakin ridiculous. Remember Tebow running all over that team in Oakland? It was freakin embarrassing and that's the kind of team you want? Just stop.


1:10 PM  
Anonymous Raider00 said...

Jones, go back and read the takes from 2011.

Everyone was high on the Raiders core of young players.
With good reason. They were playing well.

If you think Raiders still fall apart, with or without Campbell, that's your opinion.

I think if Campbell stays on field, Raiders make playoffs.

Hue Jackson can say whatever he wants.
But Hue Jackson traded the world for Carson Palmer.

That trade, and Palmers 16 picks, is what cost Jackson his job.

Let's say Cambell stays healthy, Raiders win 10 games and make playoffs. Is that shambles ?

Even at 8-8, is that shambles ?

The shambles came when the solid core of young players began regressing the following season.

The shambles came when the 2012 draft was traded for Palmers 16 picks.

And this all happened after Al Davis died.

Sorry Jones, but that's just the way it happened, and you can look it up.

3:42 PM  
Anonymous Raider Nate 75 said...

The meaning of my statement "I will not settle for less this next season" is quite simple. It means I don't have to throw my hard earned money on their swag, or to watch them play. I can use that money elsewhere, and watch highlights of the team until they improve.

I can still be a fan, support the team, rah-rah-rah; but not nearly as much as I am now. People who know me, know I'm a diehard, and will always be. But if there is no significant change this next season and the same regime stays aboard; I will not be on board and will find a new way to occupy my time during football season.
Does that clarify it for you? Are you really that sensitive that you need an explanation to my "threats, ultimatums, tough talk"?

Yes, I've sat through the last decade+ of losing record after losing record; and I'm tired of the record. This is the benchmark year for the new regime, no more excuses, no more faulty cop-outs of how the last regime left things. The Raiders are where the Chiefs were 2 seasons ago, and last season made the playoffs. This is where the Raiders are. They have a few more holes to fill than the Chiefs; but now they have the $$ to fill them. Time to put up or shut up for McKenzie and Co.

3:49 PM  
Anonymous JONES said...

Oh man....Those players were so good......where are they now? Are you telling me that once Al Davis passed, those players became mediocre? You want Campbell as your QB? Tom Kelly, Richard Seymour? McClain, Huff, Routt? McFadden, DHB, Bush, on and on? You call that a good core? You are completely whack if that is what you think and not worth another word from me.


6:03 PM  
Anonymous JONES said...

OK Nate, my guess is you will be right where you have been in the last 10 years...we all say that shit, but do we really do it? My comment was mostly a general statement, so many Raider fans threatening this and that...where is the Billboard?


6:08 PM  
Blogger Calico Jack said...

Davis left the team in shambles AND Hue gave it that final push off the cliff with the Palmer trade. No two ways around it.

7:20 PM  
Blogger nyraider said...

"There are no built-in excuses anymore." (Mark Davis)

"I went to school in Chico, and 4-12 last year and 4-12 this year are the same thing to me. I don't find one better than the other." (Mark Davis)

So it's probably safe to say Davis doesn't think much of 6-10 either.

"We had these games that we were ahead at halftime and then we lose them. It's hard to have patience when you see that. Being patient is tough." (Mark Davis).

4:01 AM  
Blogger nyraider said...

“The deconstruction part has been done very well. I am just not sure that we put pieces in place,” Davis said.

“…even though we’ve been deconstructing, that didn’t mean we couldn’t have been adding players over these last two years that could be part of the foundation of this franchise. And I am not so sure that we’ve done that yet.”

4:07 AM  
Anonymous Raider00 said...

Well, if Al Davis left the Raiders in "shambles", and his last QB was Jason Campbell.

Why am I reading so many takes that would like to bring Jason Campbell back now ?

If Campbell was the QB of a team in shambles, doesn't that make him a larger part of the problem ?

And obviously, you must believe that had Campbell remained healthy, Raiders still would have missed playoffs.

Because a playoff team could not be considered a team in shambles.

So please, no more talk of a Jason Campbell return.

Why would you want to bring back the QB from the "shambles" era ?

5:19 AM  
Anonymous Raider Nate 75 said...

I also liked these comments in the article. It seems Mark Davis feels the same way about the Raiders that most of us on this page do.

"When you're not winning, there are always thoughts. But you have to look at the whole picture. You can't act on emotion. You just can't do it. I see continuity being a good thing, but you have to have the right kind of continuity. I am giving these guys a chance to do it."

"Q: It is a very deep draft. Is taking the best player available the way to go, given all your needs?

A: I would think so. But I don't know if you can fully go with the best player available. My philosophy would be to start building the foundation of the team. Wide receiver - there are a lot of them this year - but I don't know if you can take a receiver at No. 5 because we have so many other needs for the foundation of the franchise."

"Q: Tough schedule next year. That won't be an excuse?

A: Hell, no. You just have to go out and win."


7:14 AM  
Blogger BlandaRocked said...

My choice at QB would be to draft David Fales from San Jose State. My reasons:

1. He had an excellent college career. Granted, San Jose State is a smaller program, but Veldeer was also from a smaller program. Fales gave better competition fits with the talent from his smaller school.

2. Fales was the MOST successful QB at the Senior Bowl. He got average reviews at Senior Bowl practices, but was the best QB in the actual game. The theory is that Fales is best when he knows his receivers. After learning his receivers for a week, he was highly effective. That might well apply to us if we have him sit behind a veteran for a year.

3. Fales is excellent reading the field and has talent in improvisation on the field. Both are required for a good NFL QB.

4. In this era I believe staying local when you can is a wise idea. It takes some of the pressure off a young athlete, and sometimes they work that much harder to be able to stay near home.

It surprises me that after Fales' Senior Bowl performance, outshining the "star" QBs, no one is discussing him as a possibility. That may be because teams that are interested him would like to keep the focus off of him so he will be more likely to fall to them.

He is expected to go early in the second round. He may be available for our 2nd round pick. I'd even be willing to think about trading down to take him in the bottom of the first round. We will certainly be able to find quality DL and OL in the later rounds.

7:55 AM  
Blogger Raider Take said...

Good find NY.

The entire Mark Davis interview:

Exactly my points of late.

"There is no question. We have to hit it right now."

"There are no built-in excuses anymore."

"Even though we've been deconstructing, that didn't mean we couldn't have been adding players over these last two years that could be part of the foundation of this franchise. And I am not so sure that we've done that yet."

7:57 AM  
Blogger BlandaRocked said...

Jones said, "Consistent Gunners are not easy to come by....nothing wrong with that signing at all."

TJ had a total of FOURTEEN tackles. You think FOURTEEN tackles as a gunner is worth about 1.5 million a year? And you think Davis over paid?

8:04 AM  
Anonymous JONES said...

You have to take Mark's comments in context....remember, he knows dick all about what a football team needs and how it is done.

He is right, it is show time and Reggie has to come through....if he doesn't, this franchise is going to be in a enormous hole. A lot of pressure....that's why they call it the NFL.....


8:19 AM  
Anonymous JONES said...

Balanda, you want to argue over a Special teams player who just got paid what is close to avg for a good gunner? As compared to Tom Kelly? Shane Lechler? Stanford Routt? Mike Huff? Kam Wimbley? Dick Seymour? Is this what you are comparing to a ST'r who is getting 1.5 Mill down the road and 700K this year. This is what you want to bitch about? Balanda, you need to pick your spots better than that.


8:25 AM  
Anonymous JONES said...

00.....anyone who wants Jason Campbell as the starting QB = like Take said = aim higher. The guy can't keep a starting job and there is a reason for that = he sucks.

When saying the TEAM was in shambles....for your sake, maybe it should have said THE ORG was in shambles. Out of whack contracts = ring a bell? Archaic Front Office = ring a bell? A core/culture on the team that was TOXIC = ring a bell? Coaches that were nothing more than yesmen...on and quickly the memory fades, hey 00?


8:36 AM  
Blogger BlandaRocked said...

How ridiculous is the NFL Network?

Identifying their top 10 Heisman Trophy winners in the NFL, they say that Tim Tibow is the 7th best player in NFL history. They put him ahead of both Marcus Allen and Earl Campbell. They completely leave Jim Plunkett off of the list.

12:21 PM  
Blogger nyraider said...

That sounds a bit out of context. Do they at least rank Tim Brown ahead of a guy that hasn't started a full season in the NFL?

4:57 PM  
Anonymous JONES said...

I think Balnda has been drinking again ...:+{ ....that's a shame.


5:37 PM  
Blogger Calico Jack said...

To add to the T. Jones discussion, the Raiders are paying $1.5M to a guy who is a Gunner, RB and CB. He could develop into a 3rd down specialist as a WR threat out of the backfield and possibly a nickel back. Paying $1.5M to an athlete like T. Jones who has upside with development, value as a Gunner, and has little to no bearing on a cap of $132+M should be the least of our worries.

As far as the 'shambles' tag, I base it on a situation where we had a roster with poor talent/depth, tons of dead money on the books, no clear direction, and a toxic locker room culture. When a guy like Jason Campbell goes down, who I personally like, and your season goes up in smoke and the panic button is pushes, it shows a lack of talent and depth.

6:55 PM  
Blogger OakTownBlues said...

So, now Mark Davis is demanding a stadium deal. I think it would be good to try to fill the one you have first, by fielding a team the taxpaying republic of Oakland would want to see on a recurring basis! That being said, the Raiders are moving. New home? Maybe 2016.

The Leisure World Raiders of Orange County
The Pahrump Raiders of Nevada
The Rhode Island Raiders
or, maybe, the y just lose the name, altogether,
The Los Angeles Boogaloos

Yeah! Good luck Mark. The playing field is just fine, just make the fans STAND!

Soooo funny. Raiders have a new thing to be distracted about, now that the coaches punching coaches is done, and the Al Davis passing away season(s), getting the *%#% over the Tuck, blaming everyone, and blowing up the roster.

Clowns, already.

2:55 AM  
Anonymous Raider00 said...


Raiders did not lack talent in 2011. They did lack a back up QB, and this doomed the season.

Al was drafting for what he knew best. Power rushing attack, and deep vertical passing game.

The young players were fitting in nicely. Mcfadden was a budding star.

Mike Bush was mowing down defenders.

Moore was a great deep threat.

Valdheer was giving Campbell time to throw the deep ball.

Even McClain had an excellent rookie season, before going crazy.

The Raiders seemed to have a solid foundation of young players to add to, and build around.

But after Al died, Reg, and D.A. came in and went in a different direction.

They believe in more of a WC offense, with short passing.

They believe, and least at first, in a softer zone blocking scheme for the running attack.

Suddenly the young players didn't seem to fit in anymore.

The foundation was dismantled, and replaced with nothing.

The young players regressed and faded.

12:23 PM  
Anonymous JONES said...

Seems the rest of the world doesn't agree, 00. I know, you and your ilk still think Al Davis had it going in the right direction....dream if you must.


1:11 PM  
Anonymous JONES said...

AND 00, if you don't remember, when Allen and Reggie took over, they gave those players a year to prove themselves and they almost all of their careers are over once they left the scholarship program that was the Oakland Raiders.


1:14 PM  
Blogger Calico Jack said...

Also 00,

Don't forget that there were productive players who could have been foundational pieces (TE Miller, DE Wimbley) who were shown the door simply because the cap had been so poorly managed.

Let's take the players you cited;

Mcfadden has been a major bust since he can never stay on the field.

Mike Bush was let go because the Raiders had significant cap issues. I have zero doubt in my mind that Reggie would have retained Bush if he had the wherewithal to do so. He didn't.

Moore is still with us and piece to the foundation.

Valdheer, if re-signed, will be a piece to the foundation. This was an excellent draft pick by Davis.

McClain was the epitome of bad character and unreliable professional. He, like many carryover players in year 1 of DA/McKenzie, was given every opportunity to prove his worth.

So 2 players of this group could be considered pieces to the roster going forward.

Context of the situation seems lost on you.

Bottom Line: When DA/McKenzie joined the Raiders, the team was an absolute mess (cap-wise, personnel, and culture).

7:03 PM  
Anonymous JONES said...

Jack...I would also put Branch in that category...Houston too if he is resigned. Other than that, just need to look at WHERE ARE THEY NOW. The core sucked, it was rotten, even Hue Jackson saw that. I feel sorry for those who have to revise history... for them to be able to stomach it. It was B A D bad and it wasn't on the cusp of greatness or any other dreamy illusion. After all that has been exposed since the passing of Mr Davis, there are still some who just don't get it.


7:20 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Reggie is one ugly ugly man sort of like the roster he has assembled. What a loser. The only thing uglier than Reggie is the Coliseum the worst stadium in North America by far

8:11 PM  
Blogger Raider Take said...

To me, it's water under the bridge.

My concern isn't how bad our personnel was under Al Davis.

It's what Reggie can do to improve our personnel in his third year, and if our current coaching staff has what it takes.

Mark Davis: "Even though we've been deconstructing, that didn't mean we couldn't have been adding players over these last two years that could be part of the foundation of this franchise. And I am not so sure that we've done that yet."

I'm not either.

It's time for Reggie and DA to shine. If they don't, do you bring them back for a fourth year?

8:45 PM  
Anonymous JONES said...

If they aren't doing the job, then they have to be replaced. Same as any other job, thing is, no one can really say one way or the other. It's how it all plays out that will decide it, as of now, it hasn't played out.

So we wait, watch and hope Reggie is the guy. Cutting their legs already, isn't giving them the time needed.....I will back them until they have proven they are not for the job. Knocking them down and creating more confusion and hysteria is not what the Nation should be doing, IMO.

Charles Woodson quote.....“There’s a list of things they need to improve and there are some guys they have to re-sign and others they have to get in free agency, but I just don’t see the Raiders as a team that’s far off if they bring the right people in,” he said. “I think D.A. has done a great job with the team and we need the players to get it done.”


10:16 PM  
Anonymous Raider00 said...

"Context of the situation seems lost on you."

Just the opposite. At the end of the 2011 season, no one was viewing the Raiders as a team in, "shambles".

I believe the term, "shambles" is a recent creation. An excuse for the Reggie, and DA regime, and the poor jobs they've done up to now.

Had Al Davis lived, the following season would have been much different. That's a fact.

Hue Jackson would have been retained.

Raiders would have had a full draft in 2012.

Raiders would have stayed with power running, and vertical passing, instead of going WC, & zone blocking.

Jason Campbell is, most likely, brought back as the starting Qb.

How it all would have turned out, I don't know.

But it couldn't have been as bad as what happened under Reg, & DA.

"Seems the rest of the world doesn't agree, 00"

Really Jones. Did you go door to door, and ask everyone in the world ?

Do they even disagree on the Isle of Malta ?

5:13 AM  
Anonymous JONES said...

Yeah, the great Jason Campbell lead by the great Hue Jackson with the Al Davis Defense shutting the door like it always did. Then the great roster that had so many TEAM first could it go wrong?

Hey silly boy, remember all those draft picks that turned into duds? But Al Davis was going to turn it all around, he wasn't going to draft anymore DHB's or Rolando's or Jemucasses....right? Just stop, you look ridiculous.


9:01 AM  
Blogger Raider Take said...

I'm not worried about Al Davis drafting better right now.

I'm worried about Reggie McKenzie drafting better.

11:23 AM  
Anonymous JONES said...

Nobody is worried about Al Davis drafting now...that is one of the reasons for optimism.


11:28 AM  
Anonymous Raider00 said...

Yes, Jones. Al made so many bad draft picks.

You can go see some of their plaques in Canton, Oh.

But you're losing focus. The question was, were the Raiders in shambles, at end of 2011/12 season ?

I still say no.

But i believe they are in a shambles right now.


Just Win Baby.

12:43 PM  
Anonymous Raider00 said...

By the way RT. I think you were a little hard on the Eagles in your take.

Rookie HC Chip Kelly makes playoffs in first year. Not bad.

I would take Kelly over the drowsy DA, any day.

And as a QB, I would take Nick Foles over Colin Kaepernik too.

Philly looks to have a bright future.

And to think, Chip Kelly took over a team in

1:47 PM  
Anonymous JONES said...

Yes, the Raiders were in shambles. In what world weren't they? In double zero's world maybe, but look around, ask someone outside of your 4 walls....where is your billboard?

Anyone with a brain knows the Org had to be redone, only a fool would want to continue what was. I don't even have to argue that because it is so obvious to this WORLD.

Once again, Chip walked into a better situation than what Allen and McKenzie did....clueless is all that is left to write.


3:13 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Hey Jones if the Raiders were in shambles I guess Hue is one awesome coach to get them to 8-8 and within one game of the playoffs all while loosing his QB and a shit defense.

I sure wish REggie had stayed with him versus hiring Denise

3:28 PM  
Anonymous Raider Nate 75 said...

Hue did not run a "ZBS" while in Oakland. He was/is a power guy. If the Bengals sign McFadden, you can guarantee we will be getting some extra picks in this year's draft from Cincy for tampering. In January, Hue made some comments about if McFadden became available he would sign him if he could; on a radio program. UH-OH! So I'm hoping that they do sign McFadden, and we get their 2nd and 3rd rounders.
Hue was a great coach for this team, but after Al passed, he got a little too big for his britches. I do wish Reg would have given him one more opportunity to be HC and collect his ego. DA hasn't shown me anything like Hue did when he was here.

3:41 PM  
Blogger Raider Take said...

Raider 00, don't mistake that for being hard on the Eagles. They made great progress.

My point is, the elite running backs and receivers don't translate to team success like quarterbacks. LeSean McCoy was a monster last year, it could only get them so far. Josh Gordon of the Browns was incredible, especially considering their quarterback situation. Yet the Browns sucked.

The equivalent elite-ness at quarterback gets you deep in the playoffs.

So job #1 is get a franchise quarterback.

How are we supposed to compete in the AFC West when we're a distant fourth in divisional QB talent in an NFL where QB is clearly the most important position?

All of this talk about getting some journeyman and then letting him compete with McGloin and Pryor...It all reminds me of the Andrew Walter, Tui, Aaron Brooks days.

We have to get it right at quarterback, somehow, some way.

5:22 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Right on Raider Nate.

Hue could call an awesome game, he got mad production out of McFadden not to mention any guy who could DHB 60 catches and 1000 yards is some sort of savant

On top of that any of you guys remember how Hue was at Andre Ward's dressing room pre fights and out and about in the community
trying to rally the Nation

The man cared and was dynamic

Bad move Reggie bad move

5:46 PM  
Anonymous JONES said...

Hue is so awesome that he lost the division to a team with TEBOW as their QB. So awesome that he had to pick up spit buckets as his new job after Oakland. Things came together that year and it was for Mr Davis.

Once he was gone, it all fell apart, remember? 1-4 down the stretch, just needed 1 more win, but no, Tebow beat them out. That was a hell of a division, wasn't it?


6:50 PM  
Blogger Calico Jack said...

Raider 00:

All you need to do is look at 4 things to realize the Raiders were clearly a shambles before DA/Reggie came on board;

(1) Cap situation / dead money on the books -- Worst in the NFL

(2) Draft situation (yes, that is Hue's fault but he was the Raiders HC/GM who did it) -- worst in the NFL with the first pick at the end of the 3rd round

(3) Losing culture -- a team that had a non-winning/non-playoff stretch for 9 consecutive seasons.

(4) Roster Turnover / Personnel Talent on Hand -- players who we couldn't re-sign due to a lack of cap resources, players with out of whack contracts shown the door, and a shoe string budget to fill the roster with 3rd tier, waiver wire specials.

Of the core roster going into the 2012 season, there are only a very small handful that deserved to keep their roster spot in 2013 and could be considered pieces to build a foundation. Go ahead, knock yourself out and tell me the players from Baby Huey's team that were above average players. The few that I can think of (Bush, Miller, Wimbley) were let go -- why? Because the franchise was in a financial shambles.

How is that not a complete shambles?

Cupboard bare in cap dollars, draft picks, and overall player talent.

The 8-8 record and Hue Jackson being a "great" coach was a mirage and had no relevant meaning or context to the MASSIVE rebuild/overhaul/upheaval required by the Raiders going into 2012. None.

8:23 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Pirate boy CJ, I looked at your list and the only thing different between now and then is a better cap situation. Loosing culture still in place. Crappy drafts the past two years that is for sure. Roster turnover there was huge turnover last year and will be again this year and the talent that is on the roster is the worst in the NFL.

So today the Raiders are in the same position as three years ago minus the cap problems but with a way way worse coach and no QB. oh yeah and less of a fan base i.e. tarping off half of the shit hole they call a stadium

Sounds like real progress. LOL

5:28 AM  
Blogger nyraider said...

Lots of doom and gloom here. Folks should be happy that the Raiders finally have the opportunity to do something constructive. They have $60M cap space, full compliment of draft picks and continuity of management and coaching going into 2014.

As Mark Davis said, "the excuses stop now!"

7:52 AM  
Anonymous Raider Nate 75 said...

Hey Take,
The Raiders had Palmer for 2 full seasons before going to the Cardinals, and he put up monster numbers with the Raiders and the Cardinals (except his first 1/4 of time with the Raiders after Campbell got hurt). But neither the Raiders or the Cardinals achieved much. Which further points to the fact that you have more than just a good/great QB.

8:54 AM  
Blogger Raider Take said...

I'm not doom and gloom. I'd call it watchful. The stakes are very high.

You do realize that if Reggie and DA can't demonstrate that they're the long-term solution over the next nine months, we'll be left with a losing team and another regime change, with little to show for three patient years.

Being hopeful isn't mutually exclusive to being concerned and watchful. I am all of those things right now.

9:03 AM  
Blogger Raider Take said...

Raider Nate, good numbers doesn't mean elite.

Palmer isn't one of the Top 10 QBs in the NFL.

Nor did I say that all you need is an elite QB.

I said that the surest way to sustained success is to build your team around a franchise QB (elite or knocking at the door of it).

The playoffs every year are stacked with the NFL's top QBs.

The same cannot be said of top players at other skill positions. How often are Megatron and Adrian Peterson in the playoffs?

It's not a coincidence that the first five teams picking in the draft also have grease fires at the QB position.

I believe that anyone who thinks the Raiders can seriously compete annually in the AFC West while being fourth in talent at the league's most important position is deluding him/herself.

9:19 AM  
Anonymous JONES said...

If the QB is there, take em. If he isn't, build up the team around the position so when that Qb is available....the team will be ready to carry forward with him. Desperation is NEVER the position you want to be in when making these decisions.

If McKenzie is being pressured into a desperation situation at QB, then that is wrong. QB is the most important position and it must be filled with a proper choice. Desperately seeking the QB will cause wrong choices. Control, stick to the plan and do nothing out of desperation.


9:51 AM  
Anonymous JONES said...

I just watched an interview with Amy Trask on freaked me out....I swear she has the look of a DAVIS. If she isn't Al's daughter, she has that me a freak, I don't care, watch this.....

Is she?


10:04 AM  
Blogger Calico Jack said...

Spineless Anon:

Yes, the losing has continued since the "Great" Baby Huey departed.

However, I look at the situation in 2014 vs. 2012 as night and day in terms of finally doing a proper rebuild -- being able to use a full complement of draft picks AND use $60M in free agency.

BTW, this is the first time in a VERY LONG time that we are in this position with a sizable war-chest to acquire top talent in free agency.

Some of you are making the HUGE mistake in thinking that how the cap is managed isn't important.

One of the reasons that the Raiders did so poorly in 2003-2011 is that Davis was short-sighted in how he spent the cap dollars, who he spent the cap dollars on, and the out of whack contracts that put us in a hole.

2:36 PM  
Blogger OakTownBlues said...

If Oak is smart, they will split a stadium with SF. WHY? They wont fill a new stadium.

That is all.


3:47 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Not sure why being anon is spineless but call myself after some weirdo pirate who btw liked to dress in women's clothes is a little strange. But hey if the pirate hat fits.

Per my point I am glad you agree that the only thing that has changed is the cap, celebrate that if you will but the talent on the team is worse than three years ago and the coaching sucks. Not progress in my opinion.

But hey as long as your cool with two 4-12 finished and another loosing year coming up. Keep sailing the stormy seas

9:10 AM  
Anonymous JONES said...

Anon is being anon because it wants to bitch and moan but doesn't want to be known in case the team does a turn around. That way, if a turn around comes, anon can gloat how he knew it all along. It's a troll thing.


1:27 PM  
Anonymous JONES said...

The reason for the Oakland attendance problem is the lack of wins and stability. If the wins come, the stability returns and so do the fans. A new stadium and a good bet your ass it would be sold out.


1:30 PM  
Anonymous Raider Nate 75 said...

"I said that the surest way to sustained success is to build your team around a franchise QB (elite or knocking at the door of it).
The playoffs every year are stacked with the NFL's top QBs.
The same cannot be said of top players at other skill positions. How often are Megatron and Adrian Peterson in the playoffs?"

The Lions, well, they are the Lions. Not sure why they were not in the playoffs. I think it is because they do not have balance on their offense. That may change. As for the Vikings, they are like the Lions when they had Barry Sanders. It seems that they just need a stable QB to make good decisions. I don't get it either.

I'm saying, the Raiders need more than a QB. Palmer wasn't elite, but he was a guy you could have built a franchise around because he could have been a guy to lead them, but he didn't want to be in a rebuilding situation. This is why he asked to be traded to Arizona. Which, if they get a RB, they will be in a great spot for the playoffs.
Palmer not only put up the numbers, he worked with the WRs, and other QBs and made them better than what they were. This is what we need at QB. But to get that QB, we need to be more consistent in our O-line and WRs. It is not there, but we have that chance this off-season to get it there.
Jason Campbell was the same for the Raiders as Palmer.
My point is, that in order for a QB to be consistent, you need a team of people around him as well. Brady has a great O-line and average RBs and WRs; which is what the Raiders should be looking at before trying to get a "franchise" QB.

1:49 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I live in Coronado and the word on around town is that Palmer thought Allen and McKenzie were jokes and that is why he wanted out. Do you blame him Arians versus Allen not close sort of like man versus child.

CJ your right man all that cap space will be great when Reggie signs some more high quality free agents like Flynn and Briesel

Jones can not wait to see what you have to say a year from now when the Raiders have a loosing record

Raider Nate I hear you dog Pryor and McGloin are not nfl starters. They are going nowhere with either

2:49 PM  
Anonymous JONES said...

What is a "loosing record"?


3:37 PM  
Blogger Calico Jack said...

"CJ your right man all that cap space will be great when Reggie signs some more high quality free agents like Flynn and Briesel"

Another ignorant statement with no clue on context. Here's a simple analogy that even a drive-by jellyfish might understand;

Reggie went to the grocery store in 2012 with $2.50 to spend. He is now going to that same grocery store with $60.00. Think the quality (and quantity) of groceries might be better with an extra $57.50 to spend?

The level of free agents that can be acquired is in direct relation to your budget. Instead of filling a roster on a shoe string budget, signing players to 1 year contracts, Reggie now has the resources to truly rebuild the team.

8:52 PM  
Blogger Calico Jack said...

BTW, John "Calico Jack" Rackhman wasn't some "weirdo" pirate who dressed in women's clothes. He was an infamous English pirate who was best known for the jolly rogers skull and cross swords black flag.

Yeah, I took a handle that reminded me of the Raiders. Hope that didn't upset your jellyfish sensibilities.

8:59 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

JONESing questions what a losing record is? Ay caramba! C'mon man! I guess you must be also a Cleveland Browns fan at this rate!? Draft Day part 2 Raiders version is what you are hoping for!? What a joke I tell you.

9:17 PM  
Anonymous JONES said...

A LOOSING record, see the difference? Or did you forget your glasses again?


11:14 PM  
Anonymous Raider Nate 75 said...

Palmer left because he felt at this point in his career, he didn't want to be on a team that was rebuilding. He wanted to go somewhere where he can help put them in a position to win it all. Arizona was a good fit for him to do just that. To say he left because DA and RM were jokes is absurd speculation considering that Palmer has spoken openly about his transition and reasons why he wanted out.
For the record, I've never said that McGloin is not an NFL starter because I do see potential in him to be a starter; but are the Raiders willing to give him time to develop as a QB; or do they want someone now who can get the job done? It seems like Raider Nation is too impatient for him to develop, and after 11 years of a losing record; I feel the same and at the same time, I feel we should give him a chance. So I'm torn.
If we want someone now who can lead this team now while we let McGloin develop, we are not going to find that QB in the draft. That is all I'm saying. All of this cry to find a "Franchise QB" in the draft is bogus if you don't have the O-line established (which we don't). With the O-line in shambles this past season; McGloin did a pretty decent job in leading us down field. I'd like to see what he can do with solid/consistent protection.
The other aspect that the O-line will help out with that we've struggled in the last 11 years; is the Red Zone. How frustrating is it to get within 20 yards, and consistently and walk away with 0 points? Some of that is vanilla coaching as well, I get that; but not having consistent protection is the other part.

8:09 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

No franchise tag for either Veldheer or Houston. I really hope Reggie is close to working out long term deals for both of them because if they leave in free agency it will be a disaster

2:10 PM  
Blogger nyraider said...

It's disappointing that Raiders have only managed to re-sign Kalif Barnes so far, with only 5 days before teams can negotiate with potential free agents.

IMO, Houston and Veldheer would be wise to enter the free agent market at this point.

Meanwhile, the Raiders have free agents besides Houston and Veldheer worth of re-signing. Jennings comes to mind, as well as Walker and Sims. All these guys were signed to inexpensive one-year deals but will look for better paydays after solid performances in 2013.

Shouldn't the Raiders start making some noice soon?

4:42 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Does anyone think, Reggie is an intelligent person. I just watched an interview with him and man he comes across as a dumb linebacker not articulate in the least.

Mark really messed up when he interview no one and hired Reggie bad bad move

5:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I would like to see RM use a lot of upfront money on Houston and Veldheer. (or any free agent really) If we spend some up front money, these dollars won't come back to haunt us later.

I am by no means a College Football expert, but rumor has it that next years draft class will be better. I believe in building the trenches first or a guy like Sammy Watkins would be ok. I checked out that Garapololololo guy and I like his skill set.

Here we go guys!!

3:51 PM  
Anonymous scorpio said...

hi all, been a while.

no time to read everyone's post so i don't know if anyone's looked at my angle...

if anyone's taken a look at our schedule in 2014, you already know it's absolutely BRUTAL. we have THE toughest schedule in football. we play our own division along with the very tough nfc west. let's take a quick look at these 2 divisions:
nfc west:
seahwaks - superbowl champs
whiners - playoffs (nfc champ. gm)
rams & cards - 2 up and coming teams

afc west:
chiefs - playoff team
chargers - playoff team
broncos - playoffs/afc champ. gm
raiders - well... you know

throw in a road game to new england.

my point is this - with all these playoff teams we face, that's a potential for another losing season! now before anyone starts ripping me a new one, i DID say "potential". but we're all even at this point.

mark davis said in response to vic tafur's question re: if the 2014 schedule is an excuse for losing - he said not just no, but "HELL NO".

which brings me to my point: if the '14 schedule is not an excuse, i do not see the raiders drafting a QB in the 1st round. there are no QB's named andrew luck in this draft and even mckenzie said that ALL the qb's in this year's draft need to sit a year. a rookie qb is NOT gonna win. and he's certainly not gonna win riding the pine for a year - NO WAY!

these guys (RMc/allen) know their jobs are on the line. a rookie qb is not gonna get us into the playoffs, or even a winning record. reggie needs to hit a home run and that home run needs to be a 500 foot monster shot. that #5 pick needs to contribute RIGHT NOW. NOT in a year. NOW! IF they DO draft a QB round 1, then i hope mark davis shuts the hell up and let's these guys do their job because they're not winning anything this year. just being real here folks. we can get a decent qb in round 2,3 or even 4. carr may drop. fales will be out there. so will boyd and garappolo. we will need a veteran to come in here and steer the ship until we get somebody (a later round rookie) to take over.

with that, i hope we get clowney or watson. but no way clowney drops to 5. work ethic questions or not.

one thing i would like to point out and i don't know if anyone's mentioned this but something's gotta be wrong with the scouting department. with so many bad draft picks so far, you've gotta wonder what the heck these guys are doing out there. am i alone on this?

OH one more - re: veldheer and houston: i (seldom drop in nowadays). i do hope they re-sign both of them. at least reggie made a good move in avoiding the franchise tag with these guys. to me, both players skills are just ok. they are definitely not dominating so both clearly don't deserve to be paid among the best in the league.

with that, i hope everyone's off-season is going great. free agency is coming so let's see what the near future holds.


4:18 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Reggie by not franchising Veldheer put the team in jeopardy of loosing him in free agency. If that happens its a colossal failure. Who will play left tackle. Good young LT are hard to find. Houston is one of the best d-lineman in free agency. If the Raiders have to overpay to keep their young talent who cares. The talent on the raiders is so thin already and with 60 mm in cap space what is the alternative? To get worse and save more money?

On espn they had an off-season blueprint of each team and at the end of the Raiders piece they show who is slotted to start at each position. Out of 22 positions 12 on the Raiders were open. In other words a long long way to go. Lets start by bringing back two above average starters.

Reggie's rate of rebuild should have us at 8-8 by lets 2017. sad stuff

5:09 AM  
Anonymous Raider00 said...

"Reggie's rate of rebuild should have us at 8-8 by lets 2017. sad stuff."

Well, not if Reggie lets Valdheer & Houston walk.

And not if Reggie blows this draft.

If that happens, Raiders won't sniff 8 wins, till 2020's.

Tough schedule coming up in 2014/15, but D.A.'s not worried.

He usually sleepwalks through the season anyway.

1:24 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...


I checked out the blueprint on espn and you forgot one thing. Of the 10 starters the two guards were Briesel and Barnes so that is really like only 8 positions out of 22 are filled. LOL

Have a great weekend

3:55 PM  
Blogger OakTownBlues said...

...btw, you are all Anonymous, and so am I... so why mention it? Phhh. Also, regarding selling out IF we have a winning team? It shouldn't matter. You can have a quality product and still lose. It's the silly "mystique" that Oaky won't despense of, and it's laughable. They have made a classless mockery of themselves, and it's high time they had a makeover... and that's actually starting, hopefully, but that's why I say, 2016, because true fitness takes time. Either you agree with this or you are in some kind of nostalgic funk. Dispense of the ether and take the high road of truth. Oakland sucks, but, nonetheless, we remain.

4:54 PM  
Blogger OakTownBlues said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

4:55 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Reggie sucks ass he is a prick and awful. The Raiders may have been stuck in the middle in Cable/Hue years but they had some legit real young talent that they could have nurtured and used as a foundation looks like it could be gone. Veldheer, Ford, Houston, McFadden could be gone McFadden and Moore has stagnated under shit QB play, Wiz still around but for how long?

That piece of garbage Reggie who would sooner shit on Al's grave and blame the cap and the situation and a dozen othe rlame excuse rather than take some responsibility like a man. He better resign Veldheer and Houston or he is just a turd trying to hang on to a job at this point.

Sorry but the Raiders with Carson were closer to relevancy at 8-8 under Hue than now.

No QB, no talent, worse stadium in the nfl, 40k attendance

Its frigging shocking how bad the state of the Raiders is like serious one of the worst franchises in North American sports

From my perspective whatever bad shape Al had them in they they have gone considerably down hill since. Gotta blame Mark, Reggie and that lightweight Allen for that

2:47 PM  
Anonymous Raider Nate 75 said...

I love what Marcel Reece recently said about the Raiders needing to make "fearless, Raider-ass moves" in free agency.

I don't think the Raiders are going to break the bank for a few players with a plethora of needs that we have. I think they will use the space and money to grab multiple guys that will bring solidarity.

The bottom line is the Raiders need to beef up both lines (the O and D Lines). I don't want to overpay for a DB or DE. Houston is a FA, but I think the Raiders can sign him with $15 mil guaranteed.

Here is a wish list (if you will) that I hope the Raiders go after: Davin Joseph (G, TB)
Ben Tate (RB, Houston)
Alex Mack (C, Browns)
Jonathan Goodwin (C, 49ers; if we don't pursue Mack)
Henry Melton (DT, Chicago)
Eric Decker (WR, Doncos)
Michael Oher (OT, Ravens)
Jared Allen (DE, Vikes)
Jason Hatcher (DT, Dallas)
Vontae Davis (CB, Indy)
Quentin Jammer (CB, Doncos)

I'd be content with signing:
Knowshown Moreno (RB, Doncos)
Mario Manningham (WR, 9ers depending on health)
Golden Tate (WR, Seahags)
Brett Keisel (DE, Steelers)
Terrence Cody (DT, Ravens)
Fili Moala (DT, Indy)
Rocky McIntosh (OLB, Lions)
Will Smith (OLB, Saints)
Roman Harper(S, Saints)
Donte Whitner (S, 9ers)
Darren Sproles (RB, Saints)

While re-signing Veldheer, Houston, C-Wood, Porter, Walker, Sims, Jennings, and Jennings.

I do not want Vick, I'd rather have Vince Young. I would be happy to get Jason Campbell back at QB if/when he's cut in Cleveland. Matt Flynn may comeback for a less amount. I wouldn't be surprised if the Raiders made a run at Matt Schaub if he's cut. The wildcard for me is Vick and Freeman. I don't want either one, but they may go after either one.

Use our #5 to get Watkins at WR or Jake Matthews if he's there. Start hammering younger linebackers, CBs, and WRs in the draft.

2:37 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Vince Young? Matt Flynn Seriously dude are you joking.

7:01 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Veldheer and Houston are essentially the two best players on the team and young ones at that. If Reggie does not end up keeping them it will be a colossal failure with 60 mm in cap space who cares if they overpay a little bit

From what i am reading REggie is going to pay a guard more than what Veldheer will get from Zona. That is seriously messed up

2:11 PM  
Anonymous Raider00 said...

I've been very critical of Reggie, and DA.

But I am going to take a wait and see approach.

Afterall, this is the moment we've been told we are waiting for.

8 wins in 2 years, all to create massive cap space.

Am empty shell of a roster that needs help across the board.

But the free agents, and the smart drafts,we are told, are headed our way.

And what free agents ?

I'm curious to see what free agents want to come to the 4 win Raiders, with no QB, and sleepy HC.

As Raider fans, we've been down this road before.
We know that free agency is a double edge sword.

Will Raiders attract the money grabbers, larry brown, desmond howard, warren sapp ?

Or will they attract players that want to help win, trace armstrong, romanowski, jerry rice ?

Free agency can go either way.

Lets see what happens.

3:35 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Retweeted by Steve Corkran
Pastor Napoleon ‏@napoleonkaufman 35m

Reggie’s about to start making some nice moves….. Watch! #RaiderNation

5:21 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Retweeted by Steve Corkran

Matt Zenitz ‏@mzenitz · 7h
Source: Rolando McClain telling people that he plans on playing in 2014:

5:25 PM  
Blogger OakTownBlues said...

Anonymous is spot on. Getting rid of Palmer was like divorcing over a little trouble.

6:37 AM  
Anonymous Raider Nate 75 said...

Raider 00:
"Will Raiders attract the money grabbers, larry brown, desmond howard, warren sapp ?" All signed by Al himself without a GM

"Or will they attract players that want to help win, trace armstrong, romanowski, jerry rice?" All signed at the recommendation of GM Bruce Allen.

I think FA signings are going to tell us a lot. If we sign a vet QB, what kind of QB will he be? Pocket or runner or both? That will tell us what kind of offense we will run.

I truly think Reggie is going to go heavy in the trenches in Free Agency on both sides of the ball. I was coming in to post what Nap Kaufman posted, but anonymous beat me to it. Marcel Reece also made a comment the other day similar to what Nap said. Let's hope the excitement I have about it doesn't deflate.

It is being reported by CSN that the Raiders have a 1 year offer on the table for McFadden; which shows little to no interest in re-signing him. They want him to go to Cincy to get their draft pick this year for tampering.

I think we are going to get some quality players in FA, and I think Reggie is going to prove naysayers wrong. We will see, and I'm excited by what we will see. Until then....JUST WIN, DAMMIT!

8:31 AM  
Anonymous Raider00 said...

Nate 75,

You make some good points.

If Reggie loses Veldheer, and doesn't replace him, Raiders will have to bring in a mobile QB.

At least Vick, & Pryor, can run, and they will need to without protection.

12:53 PM  
Anonymous Raider Nate 75 said...

Veldheer gone to Arizona for 5 year, $37.5 million. Raiders just signed Rodger Saffold to 5 year, $42.5 million to replace Veldheer.

Houston signed with Chicago.

1:13 PM  
Anonymous Raider Nate 75 said...

Veldheer thanks DA and Sparano for the experience. Then why didn't you stay?

1:23 PM  
Anonymous Raider Nate 75 said...

Dumb move so far by the Raiders; re-signing McFadden to a 1 year $4 million deal.

2:35 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Can we now all agree that Reggie is a complete idiot. How do we loose Veldheer for less money than what we pay a guard-Stafford.

The Raiders lost their two best players today

The team is not going in the right direction

2:42 PM  
Anonymous memdf said...

I screamed for a GM for years. Now we have one and he is a fool. Sad state of affairs. Too bad the fans can't become free agents.

3:09 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Tim Kawakami @timkawakami
In January, McKenzie suggested Raiders F/A's he wanted most to keep: Veldheer, Houston, Jennings and Woodson. Well, Woodson's still there.

3:57 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Where are all the Reggie nut huggers now? I can't wait to see how Jones and Calico spin this one. Loosing two cornerstone young players that is just a disgrace. I guess they did not believe in the crap Reeggie and Denise were selling

4:08 PM  
Anonymous Raider00 said...

Day one of free agency.

Raiders lose Veldheer, Houston, Jennings.

Gain, Saffold. Keep Mcfragile.

Are we better yet ?

4:17 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

All Aboard!!!!

The Official Fire Reggie Train is leaving the station. I am sooooooo pissed right now. My wait is over, fuck ol' red.


5:32 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

It blows my mind that we are paying a guard more than Veldheer. Veldheer wanted to resign with the Raiders. If Reggie had offered him what he offered this putz from the Rams back in Feb he would be a Raider now. However, Reggie trying to outsmart everyone ended up offending Veldheer. Just frigin awful


6:45 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

It blows my mind that we are paying a guard more than Veldheer. Veldheer wanted to resign with the Raiders. If Reggie had offered him what he offered this putz from the Rams back in Feb he would be a Raider now. However, Reggie trying to outsmart everyone ended up offending Veldheer. Just frigin awful


6:46 PM  
Blogger Raider Take said...

free agency take us now up!

8:07 PM  

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