Sunday, December 02, 2012

Browns Gameday Thread

Before we begin, let me take both sides of the running debate here at Raider Take...

When a new regime underperforms with a crappy roster, few draft picks and salary cap issues, (1) you can't excuse the previous regime for creating the crappy roster, wasted draft picks and salary cap issues; (2) nor can you excuse the new regime for underperforming with the hand it was dealt.

It's going to be wet and wild in Oakland today, if we can't beat the Browns at home, then watch out, the fur will really start flying...

48 Comments:

Anonymous JONES said...

How are they under performing? The same players went 1-4 down the stretch last year...this is what they are. Maybe the coaches came into Oakland thinking they could "coach up" these guys. These guys may not fit their schemes, but what schemes do they fit? So they went 3-0 after going 4-4 to start the season, last year. They then went 1-4 to end the season, the myth of them being "so much better last year" is a joke. They played in the worst division and they lost out to a team who's QB was Tebow. The Great Hue Jackson said it himself...there isn't much to get out of these players, so how can you hang it on the coaching? It's just a politically correct answer, which I am not partial to.

12:39 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

What a surprise, 1st play and Kelly leaves his gap.

1:34 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Raiders get a turnover, they needed that in the worst way.

1:37 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Burris is looking tired, He isn't used to the NFL season. Guy sticks out a straight arm like that, swat it away and make the tackle. Instead he takes a right hand to the chops and can't reach and falls flat on his face.

1:53 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Palmer's choices are a head scratcher, his decision making has been getting worse as the season moves along. Much of the red zone decision making on his part has resulted in 3's.

2:04 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Here we go again, down by 10, abandon the run and chase all game, yippeee.

2:09 PM  
Anonymous 5er said...

Unfortunately, the only time we start moving the ball is after we fall behind. Its obviously conventional wisdom to pin our struggles on the defense... but this offense just can't move the chains wth any consistency until teams start falling back into softer packages while protecting big leads.

Just another 4 posessions without a score... against the browns. 0 for our first 6 posessions last week against Cin. Hard to believe how far this unit has regressed.

2:18 PM  
Blogger AvantGrape said...

Going back to his days with the Bengals, Palmer has never been known as an "intelligent QB." He's a B-grade NFL gunner. Great arm, decent accuracy and solid pocket presence. Can't see the field on the elite level though, and his 'gunner's ego' get him in trouble when it really matters. That said, we don't have anyone better, and I have no faith in this organization's ability to develop a young QB. It's going to take a while before the organization corrects its management problems of the past under Al.

2:26 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Was that 4 drops in 1 drive? D.Moore, catch the frickin ball.

2:28 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Mike Mitchell is clueless.

2:29 PM  
Blogger AvantGrape said...

This team really does suck. The talent is pathetic, and the coaching is below average. The Raiders need to rid themselves of all people connected to the old regime and then start to rebuild. It's the only way now, and the only way it's ever been. Pathetic and embarrassing. I don't even care if we're winning at this point. If that's what it takes to wake people up, so be it.

2:29 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Football intelligence...GTFO of bounds, DHB forgets and Myers does it twice...are these guys even in the game mentally?

2:43 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Drops, missed blocks...just kills any momentum that is developed, useless. I don't know how the coaches can be blamed for all the drops, missed blocks, poor coverage...if only they could hold the players hand and guide them on how to do it while the play is happening? Otherwise, it's on the players to make the plays.

3:27 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

See, making plays, if the players are making plays, it makes the schemes better, TD pass, blocked FG, 2 passes batted down.....do this for 60 minutes and what a difference it would be. But, as they give up a 3rd and long pass for a 1st down, they fall back into their standard = ain't good enough.

3:42 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

DHB and D Moore BENCHED, coaches have had enough.

3:51 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Horrible throw by Palmer, got the one on one and got no air under it.

3:53 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Lamar Houston is the best player on Defense, wtf is happening with Burris, he WAS the surest tackler

4:10 PM  
Blogger AvantGrape said...

Only the Raiders of all organizations would have DHB as a starter. Time to wake up. He's third string caliber player at best.

4:21 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

3-9 from a team that was a win and get into the playoffs a year ago. Time to put the bench players in and see what we've got so we'll know what we need for next year. The Raider braintrust may not want to hear about "rebuilding" but admitting you have a problem is the first step to truly turning things around in Oakland.

4:40 PM  
Anonymous JONES said...

If you read Reggie's 'state of address' you would have heard him say he will bring in upgrades at most positions...if that isn't telling you that they have already admitted to themselves that it is a mess and will take some time to clean up, then I don't know what is.

They aren't going to come right out and say the players suck and only a select few will be a Raider next year. So they say they want wins and blah blah blah, they have to say that. I'm sure when they are alone together, they know that it's a lost cause with these players and know they will be gone.

JONES

5:01 PM  
Blogger Stuporburg said...

It's so bad that ii's so good! Even then, the Bolts have been doing their best to help the Raiders (they are only one win ahead of the Raiders), but the Chiefs have just wan a game ane they are only one game behind the Raiders.

Will the remaining season be filled with excitement, now that these three forlorn division rivals must compete for the 4th place! :D

5:03 PM  
Anonymous gary said...

MORAL VICTORY! We didn't get blown out by one of the worst teams in the NFL!

Woo hoo!

The SB is within reach with this new guidance! How could anyone question this coaching staff???








5:04 PM  
Anonymous gary said...


Blogger AvantGrape said...

Only the Raiders of all organizations would have DHB as a starter.

>>>>


Moore drops four passes.

And Al is dead, who are you blaming it on now?

5:06 PM  
Anonymous gary said...

Supposedly Gannon reported that the players do not respect Allen, and I heard something similar a week ago from a reporter from Yahoo.

Sorry folks... this dog don't hunt.

I do not think we should fire Allen, but if there is any of his coordinators left after a 3-13 season, I don't know what St. McK is thinking...

5:09 PM  
Anonymous JONES said...

Do these players respect any coach? That could be attributed to the old culture.

JONES

5:22 PM  
Anonymous Raider00 said...



"Gannon reported that the players do not respect Allen"
*******************************************************************

Really. That's a laugh.

Did these players respect Cable ? How about Jackson ?

It's the same players.

Which HC did they respect so much that they made the playoff's for him ?

Hmmmmmm. I can't think of any.

Same old excuses from these loser players.

5:32 PM  
Anonymous scorpio said...

it IS the OLD culture jones. that's why this team needs to be blown up. gotta let the new regime see what they've got. that's what this year was about. now let's get rid of all of al's guys and bring in a real team. goodbye everyone except the youngsters.

btw folks, i just splurged on a customized #24 nike elite jersey with MY name. I like the # and dammit, if i'm gonna pay $300 for a freakin jersey, it's gonna be my own name on it. i hear it'll take 4-6 weeks to get delivered. JUST IN TIME FOR THE PLAYOFFS! oh wait! we're not going to the playoffs! but @ least i'm still sportin' my gear! see? haven't let this losing crap bug me :o)

5:34 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Look out! There's a forest hiding in all these trees. The "old culture" went .500 and was a win against San Diego away to getting into the playoffs. The guy that was hired by He Who's Name Shall Not Be Mentioned and fired by this "new culture" came closer to making chicken salad out of this chicken bleep as you are fond of calling it. When will you see said forest hiding amidst said trees? When will you hold this "new culture" accountable? How about never since Al Davis didn't hire them.

5:36 PM  
Blogger nyraider said...

Can't say it wasn't expected. That game pretty well sums up another miserable season.

Raiders pulled Moore and DHB at some point in the second half. Moore has jumped the shark since last season. He's not worthy of being on the field right now.

Raiders can't even field a team to beat the Browns at home. In the end, the Browns were the better team. That's a shame!

5:36 PM  
Blogger AvantGrape said...

Gary, the organizational and personnel issues passed on from the Al era remain. Big duh there. Not that I have any interest in focusing on blame. Fixing what stinks is the most important issue, and there's a lot of 'stink' in Raiderville. Time to clean the organization of its 'stank.'

5:43 PM  
Blogger AvantGrape said...

Yes Gary, Moore is not a starting caliber receiver either, but he has the athleticism to be a situational receiver if he improves. Let's not even get into the receivers you've said would be top guns over the years. Pretty embarrassing stuff.

5:45 PM  
Anonymous gary said...

Blogger AvantGrape said...

Gary, the organizational and personnel issues passed on from the Al era remain. Big duh there. Not that I have any interest in focusing on blame. Fixing what stinks is the most important issue, and there's a lot of 'stink' in Raiderville. Time to clean the organization of its 'stank.'

>>>


So what are your suggestions? Mine is to hire an actual blue-chip OC and pick up a real number one receiver and bolster the o-line through the draft.

Get a blue-chip FS and MLB through FA.

Go...

5:49 PM  
Anonymous JONES said...

I thought these players would of loved to get out of the old culture...looks like they completely embraced it. The core seems to be stuck in a false reality. They think they are much better than they are.

In the McKenzie interview, he mentioned that the coaches have told them and repeated their assignments and that he is tired of hearing "my bad" when they blow their assignments. That's what the players are used to, failure, "oh well, just say my bad and it's all good". NOT ANYMORE.

JONES

5:50 PM  
Blogger AvantGrape said...

The players don't respect the organization as a whole and it's been that way for years. It's going to take a while to fix, and IMO, a true effort needs to be made to clear out all of Al's loyalists, be them coaches, players or any Al's most favored.

5:52 PM  
Anonymous JONES said...

The "new culture" will be judged when the "old culture" has been shown the door...like McKenzie said, some guys you just can't change.

JONES

5:54 PM  
Blogger AvantGrape said...

I said to Gary:

"Let's not even get into the receivers you've said would be top guns over the years. Pretty embarrassing stuff."

You know what? My apologies. No reason existed for me to start up a flame war.

5:55 PM  
Blogger AvantGrape said...

Gary said: So what are your suggestions? Mine is to hire an actual blue-chip OC and pick up a real number one receiver and bolster the o-line through the draft.

Get a blue-chip FS and MLB through FA.

Go...
------
All excellent suggestions, but I think we need the organizational structure in place to make any of that work. I have NO IDEA if Reggie can make that transformation, but if doesn't happen, it won't matter what coach we bring in here IMO.

5:59 PM  
Anonymous JONES said...

What about the D-line, Gary? Or the CB's? Looks like the team could use 2 new LB's, need Wr's, QB, RB, .....Reggie has a lot of work to do to get this roster respectable.

JONES

6:00 PM  
Anonymous gary said...

Anonymous JONES said...

What about the D-line, Gary? Or the CB's? Looks like the team could use 2 new LB's, need Wr's, QB, RB, .....Reggie has a lot of work to do to get this roster respectable.

>>>

I am a minority in thinking we don't need much changes in D line. Just better coaching and schemes.

We need a FA CB too (Asum?) and let me be clear.. I don't think we just need a blue chip OC willy-nilly... we need one that works well with CP and McF.

Knapp was the perfect storm for killing them both. He no only changed the scheme that McF obviously loved, but his main focus was trying to change the gun-slinger Palmer into a Gannon-like QB. NO INTERCEPTIONS!!

That's why if Hue had ONE MORE YEAR...this could have worked!!

I still can't get over it, sorry. This team was built for a Hue-like offense.

A competent administration would have built off that.

6:26 PM  
Blogger OakTown Blues said...

Nice one Scorpio, my keeper jersey has my name on it too, and i am not bothered at all by this either. 2016.

7:05 PM  
Blogger Calico Jack said...

Reggie has a herculean task of building this team from the ground up.

As far as any rumors of "players don't respect Dennis Allen" -- nothing but BS rumors and even if true, who gives a shit. Hold the phone if a knuclehead like McClain doesn't respect his head coach.

The toxic weeds, unprofessional, delusional, "me" culture losers need to be uprooted and shown the door.

7:25 PM  
Anonymous JONES said...

"A competent administration would have built off that."

I think a competent admin is looking at the big picture. McKenzie said he is going to build a TEAM that will contend for years, not for MAYBE 1 year. Your wishful thinking may have brought a team that finished 8-8 again, with Manning running the Donkies, 8-8 isn't even close, Gary.

"That's why if Hue had ONE MORE YEAR...this could have worked!!"...

And that's why Hue said he was going to make plenty of changes when he thought he was going to run the team? Just admit it, the roster isn't and wasn't good enough. Hue or no Hue, 1-4 down the stretch last year in a very weak Div. All these guys crying over a mediocre roster, why? Because they are Mr.Davis players? So you have to cling to the notion that they were good enough to be Super Bowl contenders? In your dreams, Gary.

This roster is poor, McKenzie said he will upgrade most positions, Allen complains about their weaknesses every week, but, in Gary's world, they are Super Bowl contenders, if they had a HC, that the team quit on last year.....as usual Gary, you make no sense.

JONES

7:39 PM  
Anonymous JONES said...

"i am not bothered at all by this either"....

Of course you aren't, you are a patriots fan.

JONES

7:40 PM  
Blogger OakTown Blues said...

...I'm a football fan Jones. And yes, Patriot ball is worth watching. Professional sports stats don't bother me one bit. I'm sorta cool like that.

8:35 PM  
Anonymous JONES said...

Either a Raider fan or not, there is no inbetween. You seem to consider yourself as "sorta cool" don't you? I don't see it.

JONES

8:48 PM  
Anonymous JONES said...

IMO, I would expect McKenzie to send a real strong message after this season. All you Mr.Davis player lovers are going to be very sad, very soon. If McKenzie does not send that message, I will be deeply disappointed, but I have a very strong feeling he will come through. The message will be....it was nice knowin ya, see you at Raider reunions in later years. As far as I'm concerned, it can't happen soon enough.

JONES

10:01 PM  
Blogger nyraider said...

"IMO, I would expect McKenzie to send a real strong message after this season."

How can he not? Raiders are a complete disaster. 12 games in and players still don't know their assignments. I'm not holding my breath for retaining any assistant coaches either.

I expect McKenzie and Allen to roll up their sleeves and make wholesale changes. 2012 is a complete failure. If the players are solely to blame, then it will be GM/HC's jobs to prove that to us.

4:27 AM  
Blogger Raider Take said...

Postgame take is up.

8:39 AM  

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