Monday, December 01, 2008

The End of The Beginning

Well, that was a killjoy of a game. So much for momentum. So much for getting geeked up against an AFC West rival at home after crushing one on the road. So much for beating a team that had lost 19 of its last 20 games. So much for pride and poise. I was there, and it was much more pathetic than the score suggests. This team is literally sucking the blood out of the Coliseum. Failure is now the expectation in the stands and the culture on the field. No urgency. No energy. No nothing.

I'm all for changing things up, but what, exactly, was Janikowski going to do once he got that pigskin with 10 yards between him and a first down? Janikowsi got as many touches in the first half as McFadden got in the second half. Think about that for a second and try not to smash something. There's changing things up, and then there's insanity. This was the latter.

I keep hearing that Russell is young. Yes, well so are a lot of quarterbacks (Ryan, Thigpen, Flacco, blah, blah, blah) who don't overthrow every receiver, and who don't wear fur coats and sunglasses to press conferences. Please play (and train) like a star, then dress like one, not vice versa.

The defense doesn't get a pass, either. Exhibit A: Gibrill Wilson dropping a pass. Blitzing? Why blitz when you can get carved up like Thanksgiving leftovers? The toughest thing about Rob Ryan right now is his hair.


Anonymous Anonymous said...

Lance Kiffin being hire by T.U. gives us some insight to what is really going on in Al Davisville. So Lance gets hired by T.U. and guess who is coming to coach the Defense? That's right MONTE, we could have had Monte instead of Ryan and this was the MAIN RIFF between Lance and Al. So now we know Lance is gone because Al didn't want a real D.C., he wanted to keep his puppet. This is when Lance KNEW that Al wasn't about winning, Al is about " who can I trust to be my lap dog". Anyone who says Al Davis should not be critisized is an IDIOT. Al is a paranoid old fart who is more interested in keeping his circle of yes men than WINNING and there is no disputing this fact.


9:21 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Did Janokowski even know he was supposed to catch the ball? I mean, he didn't even make an effort to catch it.
That game was the essence of our last 6 seasons. Like I said last week, the concern I had about that win was we showed what we were capable of doing, but there has been no consistency of doing it.
I am going out to Cali in December, and almost bought tickets to the Texans-Raiders game. Almost. I decided last night not to waste my money after the Raiders lost again. I'll wait for change, and change needs to start in the owner's booth.
I'm not sure if Al's son is the right choice either. I mean isn't son of Al in his 70's? I think he sells the team after daddy goes.

Jones, why do you keep referring Kiffin as "Lance?" Is it to poke fun at him, or do you not realize his name is Lane? Just curious.

10:27 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Al Davis called him " Lance" when he introduced him at his hiring conference. It's a play on Al not even knowing the name of the guy he is hiring. But hey, Al is God right?


10:53 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...



10:59 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Greg, who in there right mind would build a new stadium and then bring Al Davis into it? Do you think cities will throw their money at Al when he has stiffed Oakland twice and L.A., packed up and moved when he couldn't get his way????? If Al can get a city to do it, which I doubt, he will go down as one of the biggest conmen of alltime.


11:10 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The worse part is I fully expected to lose to the Chiefs. You don't just get rid of all the dysfunction overnight. We will be an underachieving team until the leadership is restored at the top. Sadly that isn't happening anytime soon.


11:31 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

What other reason would there be for Al to run his team...Our team into the Bottom of the Toilet? I still say that Al is Mr Weekend at Bernies when it comes to this team. No One will come and coach here with this JOKE of an NFL team. Fossel is willing to go "under" Al's desk for the entire season...This I predict to be the Very Late coach hire after interviewing a few losers.....Unreal!! When will this nightmare end????

Raider Greg

1:02 PM  
Blogger nyraider said...

We officially have 6 straight losing seasons under our belt. Anyone want to guess how far we can extend that streak? Seven seasons seems very realistic from where I'm sitting.

Can one team actually be this bad for this long... without trying?

3:08 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

in the words of roger daltry, "we won't be fooled again".

yes, i fell into the trap after last week. i convinced myself it could be a turn around game. that the raiders were going to surge right through the end of the season, and give us all great hope for next year.
oh what a difference one week makes.

instead the raiders crawled right back to their comfort zone of losing.
a nice, warm place were there's no pressure, and old uncle al looks after everyone.
all except for the head coach that is. uncle al will get rid of the terrible coach, and all will be joyful in candyland again.

it's a place where players can bring no effort, get paid like kings, and lose, lose, lose, but never lose their jobs.
ahhhh, like a slice of heaven on earth.

gather round players/children, snuggle up with your nice comfy blankets. uncle al is going to tell bedtime stories tonight.

rockabye babies on the tree top...

3:23 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The shocker this season is not that we lost to the 1-19 Chiefs.

The really big shocker is that we actually beat two division leaders in the Jets and Broncos.

Until we get the fundamentals down pat, like blocking and tackling and making a play instead of giving up a play, our losing ways will continue.

We have the highest payroll in NFL. And, please don't compare us to the Yankees. They are at least competitive. We were officially out of the playoff hunt by the middle of September.

My NFL joy in life now comes from watching the Chargers lose another game.

Notice how much less snarfy Phil Rivers is at 4-8?

This is a Top Down problem. Our culture insures losing.

The Chargers fire Marty, one of the true motivators in sports and replace him with Norv, one of the tue losers. They take a loaded club and are suddenly an 8-8 (at best) team. Shocking, but not unexpected.

Miami goes 1-15. Brings in Parcells, who does what he does everywhere he's ever gone - Just Win Baby. Giants, Pats, Jets, Cowboys and now Dolphins.

We need T H A T guy. An NFL football guy that will direct the football end of the team - find talent, hire and keep good coaches and let the system and players grow into a winning culture.

3:51 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

If Al is losing on purpose, he is more insane than first assessed. If he is losing on purpose, he has no loyalty to any Raider fan and he would be the biggest disgrace EVER in sports history. If Al is losing on purpose, then there shall be no loyalty to Al Davis.


4:45 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I keep asking myself, WHY the f### are the fans STILL packing the stadium for? UNFRICKONBELIEVEABLE!!!

RAIDER TAKE, I can't believe you fell for it again. When are you and the rest of the 50,000 fools going to learn? Might as well flush your $$$$$$ down the toilet.
What is the THRILL of losing GAME AFTER GAME? I feel sorry for all you SUCKERS that keep attending these semi-pro Raider games.




7:21 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

My sentiments exactly - I can only watch the boobs on the tube and it amazes me that people actually still buy tickets to see the mess Al calls a football team. I would have sent my season tickets back by now.


8:49 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...


i agree with you and it would seem to me that, THAT GUY, is bill cowher.

if the raiders really did have a true commitment to excellence, there would be no doubt cowher is the man we would go after.

in reality, the raiders DO NOT have a commitment to excellence, so we will end up wih retread like jim fassel, who no one else would hire.

9:20 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Raider00, no way anyone comes to Oakland that is worth a hill of beans. No way, Cowher would laugh at the notion. See others calling for Shitinhimer, as if he would work for Al. How long you been a fan? and you don't know this?


10:13 PM  
Blogger PantyRaider said...


Currently in position for the #6 pick in the "09" NFL Draft....Who is on the board????

Just go out and loose baby and see if you can move up a slot or 2 in the draft so we can trade away our 2nd-3rd-4th-n-5th rd picks on some "Basket-Case" reject player who won't show up and play....

Wake me up in "2011" when we move out of town and start winning again....

PantyRaider....Future "Bag-Boy"s of the NFL West!!!!/_

5:29 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...


7:41 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Panty... you were the biggest cheerleader ANYWHERE for bringing in a RB when we needed help on either line, so spare me the indignation about Al making a stupid pick next season.

Most of you here were for McF... I'm not going to let any of the McFaddenites act like its only Al that makes moronic picks... you all wanted it too.

8:49 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Panty, you turncoat, now you are wanting/ promoting "loosing"? It's spelled LOSING. Now that you have been shown that you don't know what the hell you are talking about and throw in the fact that you can't have no credibilty. Writing in English and make some freakin sense would be a good start.


9:08 AM  
Blogger Raider Take said...

Gary, it doesn't matter if I was high on Todd Marinovich (pun intended) or Darren McFadden or Robert Gallery.

I don't own and run a football team. I don't get paid hundreds of thousands of dollars to watch film, evaluate talent, conduct pre-draft interviews, etc.

To implicate the fan equally with an owner or GM for failed acquisitions or drafts is absurd.

As far as I know, PantyRaider and I aren't on the Raiders payroll or in the NFL Hall of Fame. Let's please hold the organization to a higher standard than Joe Fan when it comes to making smart personnel decisions.

P.S. The jury's out on McFadden. He's not getting enough touches.

12:59 PM  
Blogger RaiderRealist said...

All I want for Christmas is a GM who can come in here with a coherent plan and truly start the process of cleaning up this mess. A GM who can hire a coach and put in stone that said head coach can bring in his own staff.

A coach who won't try to have Janikowski try to to run 10 yards for a first down on a fake field goal.

Then maybe we won't see stupid stuff like sitting on LaMont Jordan and keeping Bush on the PUP list because we're scared he'll go to an AFC West team and come back to haunt us. How's Jordan doing in NE?

Then maybe we won't see us trade a 2nd round pick for known headcases such as DeAngelo Hall who wish aloud in the press that they wish they had gotten more money out of the owner.

Maybe we'd stop bringing in overpriced free agents like Javon Walker who have an injury history to go along with the reputation of being a malcontent.

And maybe, just maybe we'd stop throwing gigantic money at unproven players that makes the rest of the NFL scratch their heads in wonderment like we did with Tommy Kelly.

Heck, we might even figure out how best to use our #1 draft pick RB and give him more carries than the kicker in a whole half of football!!!

Finally, after hiring a GM and letting him run the football operations maybe, just maybe, we could get back to a tradition of winning football in Oakland instead of SIX STRAIGHT YEARS of losing seasons!!! That's all I want for Christmas.

1:27 PM  
Blogger nyraider said...

Sorry Realist, that's not very realistic.

I didn't really lobby for McFadden, but I don't regret us drafting him. He showed some serious receiving skills this week, grabbing rifled shots out of thin air, and behind him no less. It's up to the coaches to properly utilize his talents.

I'm more concerned with JaMarcus Russell, whom I did want with the #1 overall pick two years ago. Where's that penchant for winning that he seemed to exude at LSU? So far all we’ve seen is inconsistency. As RT points out, there are a plethora of first-year QBs who are playing circles around Russell. It’s time to man-up and earn some of that money.

3:35 PM  
Blogger RaiderRealist said...

That's why its a Christmas WISH, NYRaider. We all know who runs things in Oakland.

Ask yourself this question: how would those rookie QBs you listed fare here in Oakland?

3:43 PM  
Blogger nyraider said...

Good question. Considering KFC is lighting things up in Tenn after laying an egg in Oakland, I guess the answer is not so good. But I will ponder that one.

As for who's running things in Oakland, obviously nobody.

4:25 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...


As far as I know, PantyRaider and I aren't on the Raiders payroll or in the NFL Hall of Fame. Let's please hold the organization to a higher standard than Joe Fan when it comes to making smart personnel decisions.

Thats fine and dandy but that doesn't let anyone off the hook when it comes to him making the EXACT SAME DECISIONS YOU WISHED HIM TO MAKE.

There should be some sort of hypocrisy standard somewhere with Raider fans.

7:49 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...


And maybe, just maybe we'd stop throwing gigantic money at unproven players that makes the rest of the NFL scratch their heads in wonderment like we did with Tommy Kelly.

I agree that Hall and Walker were nightmare decisions, but Kelly isn't playing that poorly... especially since DT's are a rare commodity.


7:55 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

My point about hypocrisy... pointing out all the mistakes that Al made (coincidentally after a loss to KC, cough) while ignoring all of the decisions that every Raider fan here was screaming for Al to do, is the definition of hypocrisy.

I read twenty people here tell me that McF was going to be the fucking savior of this team... and Al picked him while we needed help on both lines.

So far you both look like fools to me.

8:01 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Kfc isn't lighting it up, they play the exact same style the Giants and Panthers did when "he " was successful there. It's called a killer Defense, KFC is managing the game, it's not like he is a Marino out there throwing 35 darts a game. They game plan around using the run to setup occasional passing, granted KFC is efficient at it. But once the game is put on KFC to win or lose, he is going to show you failure. This is the secret to beating the Titans, you need to put the game into KFC's hands, he will lose it and will revert to the KFC we saw in Oakland. KFC in no way is "carrying" the Titans.


8:10 PM  
Blogger PantyRaider said...


Don't read into my post...It's clear what I'm saying...We "Suck" as a franchise....If you read anything earlier you would see I still support the "QB"-n-"RB" but they have "NOT" been put in a position to win or even perform at a consistant level as a result of the decisions by management and the coaches....I'm quiet sure "McFab" would be a spectacular player had he gone to the Jets at #6....

I did "NOT" say we would draft a bad player in the 1st rd....I said we would do something stupid with the remaining picks as in trading them away for a player who would not perform....Now go back and read it again before you start taking cheap shots at me....There are enough ligitimate things to "Bitch" about without trying to make something up....

You were wrong....Get over it...I was right...So Freaken What...We are still loosers no matter who we have on the roster...The "O" has a good core at "QB"-n-RB"-n-"TE"...But with our fearless leaders we are at the bottom of the "O"s in the NFL....Just look at the #s of our #25 "O"...


Rushing is the only strong point at #10 but this should be #1 with the personel we have in the back-field...

Now here is something interesting about the "D" as bad as it is @ #25...

Sacks.....#10 (Tie)

But than there is the reality...

Total Yds.#25

A good foot-ball-mam like the "Tuna" or Kohwer could turn this whole thing around in one freakin season but we have "ZERO" chance of having that in OakTown....

PantyRaider....Totally Discusted!!!/_

8:45 PM  
Blogger Calico Jack said...


For the record I was and I'm still a firm believer that Russell and McFadden were the right choices. IMO, these 2 players are exceptional athletes and hard workers who haven't shined (yet) due to a host of circumstances and reasons (career development, injuries, holdout, poor playcalling, etc). If both players are utilized properly and supported adequately, the sky would be the limit.

My problems stem from a wide array of other decisions which have significantly impacted the bottom line ... wins. Here's a list of poor decisions, short sighted negligence, and general mismanagement of the Raiders.

(1) The indecisiveness of the Kiffin firing. Why wait until week 5 to fire Kiffin? If it is a foregone conclusion that Davis and Kiffin were not compatible at the end of the 07 season, fire him in January of 08 ... waiting until week 5 served no purpose whatsoever.

(2) The promotion of Cable to HC. The guy is clearly ill equipped to make the most elemmentary game time decisions. You might ask, "Well who the hell should have been installed as an interim HC" ... the answer is there wasn't anyone on staff who was a worthy candidates which is a problem in itself. The coaching staff, just like the player personnel, needs to be developed and groomed to take on increased responsibliity. The fact we had no worthy candidate is a sad state of affairs.

(3) Cap Management: The Raiders have the highest payroll in the NFL ... not exactly getting the most bang for the buck, are we?

(4) Free Agent decisions
(a) Kelly, a good player, but who were we bidding against?
(b) Walker, a player with an injury and bad conduct history ... who were we bidding against
(c) DeAngelo Hall > $1M a game for piss poor performance plus the loss of key draft choices
(d) Kwame Harris > a major bust
(e) John Wade > a backup being paid starters money

(5) The complete vacumm at GM. If it doesn't strike you as odd and completely dysfunctional that we are the only team in the NFL without a GM, I don't know what to say. Anyone who thinks Al has the time, energy, and focus required to handle all of the duties of an owner and GM is only kidding themselves. Not having a GM is a MAJOR handicap.

(6)The overall construction of the team is flawed. The OLine and DLine need to be top priorities in the draft and free agency. Our DLine needs to be fortified especially at DT. Our OLine needs at least 2 OTs. The emphasis this past off season was largely on the peripheral skill position players such as Hall, Carter, Walker, Lelie. We drafted Shillens and Watkins. Until the trenches are built with a solid foundation of both free agents and draftees, the skill position players are not going to shine.

(7) To put all the pieces together you need a coherent short term and long term plan. To execute both plans you need to hire a capable GM and HC. To get results you need the GM and HC to build a system and identify players that fit a profile. For the GM and HC to be truly effective, they need to be given the time, resources, and authority for 3 years.

The reality of the situation is that we haven't rebuilt or reloaded in each off season. Instead we have haphazardly constructed a team where sustainable success is next to impossible to achieve.

Items (1) through (7) falls on Davis' shoulders. No way to get around it.

If you are looking at the Raiders situation objectively, until a football savvy executive GM is brought on board and a proven HC is hired, gaining traction will be very difficult.

Look at any successful team in the present or past, and you can safely say they have/had good, competent people filling the 4 key leadership positions;
QB, HC, GM, Owner

We've got a struggling QB who could still have a very bright future if the organization would get its act together.

We have a lame duck, interim, dead man walking HC who will resume as OLine Coach in 09.

We have a vacuum at GM.

We have an owner who at an advanced age, health problems, and trust issues, simply needs the help of a GM.

How on earth do you field a competitive team under these conditions?

QB: KFC, Brooks, Walter, Russell
HC: Callahan, Turner, Shell, Kiffin, Cable
GM: vacant since Allen left in 03
Owner: Davis

Six straight seasons of double digit losses ... if this isn't reason enough to change the way business is being conducted in Alameda, what's it going to take?

If I'm the owner of the Raiders, I would understand the importance of having a GM. Without a GM, how are you going to recruit and hire a proven HC? Without a proven HC, how are you going to attract top FA talent and have a competitive advantage on game day?

The bottom line is that the Owner, GM, and HC are a partnership to building a team. The partnership finds solutions systematically and in conjunction with a short and long term plan. All the roles of an owner, GM, and HC are different, ultimately these 3 men in some shape or fashion collectively build a T E A M.

8:57 PM  
Blogger Raider Take said...

Well said, folks.

Gary, how is it hypocrisy to hold the organization accountable for poor decisions? As a fan, I could be passionate about drafting a kicker in the first round (again). If the team goes ahead and does it, that doesn't make me a hypocrite, it just makes me and the organization both wrong, with one significant difference: my job isn't to get it right.

You're falling into the trap of giving excuses where there are none.

As for McFadden specifically, yes I wanted him, and I'm not ready to back away from that (although as a fan, that's my right - I'll be happy to repay my GM salary: $0.00). How can you have a first-round running back of his potential and limit him to seven carries during week twelve? Fargas got 150 percent more carries than McFadden on Sunday. NOW, if I'd known McFadden was going to be misused, that might have changed my perspective on things. I guess I should have anticipated that?

9:13 PM  
Blogger PantyRaider said...


My coments on LOOOOOsing were in response to the posters before me stating that the team was loosing intentially to get out of Oakland...Now if you want to attack someone plaese continue your attacks on Greg who thinks this is intentional...Not on me for posting..."Sarcasim"....Or do you take everything you read..."Literally"....

NOW...Sense you have questioned my..."Credibility"....Where the hell is yours...Build a reputation as a "FAN" 1st before trying to compair yourself to others...And "YES"....I "Can't" spell...But the things I can do far exceed your ability to hide behind a "Key-Board"....

The last 3 months have been spent in arms way...Cambodian Police who try to take me down in September for the sake of money...But Failed....Border War between Thai-n-Khmer in October while I travel 250 KM to save my young wife on a total "Rat" Bike that would not be allowed on the streets of America...And now in the middle of a "Coup" with bombs-n-guns at the airport while I'm trying to vacate....

You "Pissing" your panties yet...I'm not....I'm coming back in a month or two with my bad spelling and all....Love the excitment....Let's ya know your alive and life is well worth fighting for...And oh yes...My traveling partner Liam is in a Thai hospital dying with blood clots in his heart while we try to get together the money for surgery...Tomorro...

So stick you your cheap attacks up your ass....

PantyRaider...FootBall is real....So is life!!!!/_

9:17 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...


i am very aware of the situation in oakland. i know that no coach of high standing will step one foot in oakland.

the point i was making was that the raiders are not even seeking a coach of high standing.

in other words, commitment to excellence is a lie.

excellence means having the best. the best players, the best coaches, the best of everything.

well, the best coach available is bill cowher. and since he has zero chance of becoming our next head coach, anything else will be second best.

commitment to excellence = tom cable ? i don't think so.

9:40 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...


My prayers go out for your traveling buddy.

I also have a friend in the area--she's a classmate of mine who just graduated and went back to Thailand (she's Thai herself) to do ministry work.

All of that mess has been awfully worrisome for us back here in the states, knowing that you in Thai are in such danger.

Stay safe, my friend.


10:26 PM  
Blogger Calico Jack said...

Raider 00: Well said.

A "committment to excellence" in my view means doing everything humanly possible to recruit, attract and retain the very best talent in the coaching ranks and player personnel. It also means giving the talent that you've acquired the resources and applicable authority to maximize their talent. It means continually striving to gain new fans and give the best possible value to the loyal customers.

Does it make sense to anyone to be cheap on paying a HC but foolish on paying marginal player talent?

Who has a greater impact on a team's success ... a HC or CB? Why is it ok to pay below market value for a HC (ie. $1.8M or lower for a HC) but wildly overspend on a CB ($1M per game to Hall)?

Does it make sense to committ 5 to 6 years to a player and only 1 to 2 years for a HC?

If one of the most important elements to building a successful team is talent acquisition ... why would you have a vacancy at GM?

Sorry gang but this shit is beyond the scope of common sense.

I'm simply an armchair NFL fan and some of the stuff that goes on in Alameda is frankly ridiculous, foolish, negligent, and a slap in the face of the devoted fans.

There is a mission statement for most medium to large size enterprises that encapsulates what the company is all about. The Raiders are a $850M+ business. The mission statement should be to accomplish the following goals:

(1) Win at all costs in the attempt to become SB champions

(2) Be highly profitable and continually strive to achieve growth in revenue and fanbase.

(3) To make the "Raider Experience" the best possible for customer satisfaction.

How are we doing on the 3 points above?

In regards to Raider00's points: I would love to see a charasmatic, dynamic GM hired who has a relationship with a proven HC who willingly takes a chance on joining a shaky organization based on the relationship with the GM.

My point being, how do you even get to the point of a top echelon HC candidate sitting down for an interview without a GM in place? From an article today, here is a potential "A" list of HC candidates for 2009:

Bill Cowher
Steve Spranulo: DC Giants
Jim Schwartz: DC Titans
Josh McDaniels: OC Pats
Jason Garrett: OC Cowboys
Pete Carroll: USC HC
Marty Shottenheimer: Out of football
Rex Ryan: DC Ravens
Mike Mularkey: OC Falcons
Kirk Ferentz: Iowa HC

Why would any of these guys join the Raiders as HC without a GM in place? Most of them are already being paid more as OC/DC/College HC than a typical Raider HC gets paid. All of them have multiple opportunities to land another job. What is the motivation to join the Raiders without a GM, at a lower pay, without any sense of reasonable job security, to deal with cleaning up another mess?

I have no problem with discovering more hidden gems AS LONG AS 2 signicant things happen which didn't with Kiffin;

#1 This hidden gem HC needs to be given the time to develop and grow with the team. A 3 year plan needs to be developed not a 1 year, bye bye plan.

#2 This hidden gem HC needs to have a GM in place to act as a buffer, advisor, arbitrator, and partner to build a team where the pieces to the puzzle fit.

10:44 PM  
Blogger SilverShark said...

If Russell remains the QB you can expect a whole lot more losing seasons! That Kid maybe the dumbest QB in History.
But one of the smartest! He and His Agent Swindled 60 million out of Al Davis!
They must sit back and laugh all the time.
Agent: Can you believe that old fucker gave in and gave up that much doe?

Russell: I cants believzz thats hes donz thats.

Agent: Well all you have to do is play a little, don't worry about studying the playbook, fake and injury and sit on all that money!

Russell: Tru dat! White folks ar dummer thanz i thoughts. Dids you seez the looks in Al's eyez whenz i tolds himz iz didn't knowz anythings abouts readin a defense. Remembers hed sayz dont worries you will learnz. Youz was sittin therez whenz i tolds hims thats ok playa id just wants the money. That oldz mans just laughed and wrotes that check and id knews i was a rich mans thens.

Agent: Oh yes JR, I also am a rich man. Thanks to that old ass bitch! In fact it reminds Me of the Movie "Trading places."
"Looking Good Billy" Feeling good lewis."

11:57 PM  
Blogger PantyRaider said...

Arkansan Raider....

Friday is the Kings 81st birthday so they have come to a temporary settlement and re-opend the airport...If it holds up long enough I will be leaving the 10th for LAX...So far they are not putting foreniners in danger but that could always change...The situation is becoming very volitile...This movement was also responsible for the attacks on the Cambodian border that caused deaths and injuries in October...This in my 3rd coup in Thailand sense "98" but this is definatly the most violent...But I love the Thai people as a whole minus the radicals that are troublemakers....Thanks for the concern...Hope your friend stays safe...As for me I'll be back here is a couple months...


I try to write hummor from time to time but stay away from the ethnic slurs....

You may not be intending it but your post reads like a biggot...In case you did not notice our franchise is a mix of all races and so is the NFL...But the Raiders have been leaders in this and our fan base is also....Being racially offensive is "NOT" funny...

As I said...I have "NO" idea what your intent was....I'm just letting you see it from another fans perspective...No insult intended...

As for "JRus" he's a rookey "QB" in a very unproductive situation...Perhaps a vetern like B. Favre could carry the team on his shoulders and make a winner out of this mess dispite the incompitance around him but there are few rookies if any who could be expected to do that...But I'm all ears if you think you could name one...The only one who could come close in my memory is John Elway but even he as a rookey was inept in that "Mule-Headed" "O"....


Rex Ryan: DC Ravens

That could be an interesting posibility....The other twin might be able to light a fire under his siblings ass and run a "D" that's a force to recond with...Sense "MrD" is so in love with Rob it may be a ligitimit posibility...

The 1st set of twins to coach together in the NFL would be another 1st for an aged "MrD" and if it worked everyone would call him a genious instead of a "Old-n-Feeble"...

PantyRaider....Find a Solution...Please!!!!/_

5:21 AM  
Blogger PantyRaider said...

As to the Anti-"McFab"ers who wanted the "DE"-"DT"...Take a good look at their rookey seasons...

Vernon Gholston
12tkls 4-solo 8-assist 0-sacks 0-fumbles....Playing for the AFCE Leader...What about him excites you over "McFab" this year and what could he have done to improve our "D" this season????....


5:33 AM  
Blogger PantyRaider said...

Jake Long 1-tackle 1-solo

Glenn Dorsey 32-tkls 25-solo 7-assist 1-sack 1-fumble

5:38 AM  
Blogger PantyRaider said...

Sedrick Ellis 22-tackles 15-solo 7-assist 2-sacks 0-fumbles....

5:43 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Hey Panty, Jake Long is an offensive lineman, I don't expect him to have a lot of tackles. How many is he preventing? Remember, Jake Long gave up only 2 sacks in his 4 year college year at Michigan. I would love to have him over McFadden right now.

6:09 AM  
Blogger nyraider said...

CJ- I'm sure the Raiders mission statement has all the right caveats, but it's just words and empty promises.

The answer to the first item on your list of poor decisions is simple; Davis wanted to establish “cause” before firing Kiffin. The couple million that he could potentially lose on Kiffin eats at him more than the tens of millions he wasted on players like Hall and Walker.

I guess we can all brace ourselves for another grueling interview process to find a new coach this off-season, as well as more haphazard-like player acquisitions combined with the usual scholarships.

As one poster aptly put, Davis seems determined to leave the Raiders in the same pitiful state he found them.

6:10 AM  
Blogger PantyRaider said...

Kalimba Edwards
44-tkls 37-solo 7-assist 5-sack 1-fumble

Jay Richardson
40-tkls 31-solo 9-assist 2-sacks 0-fumbles

Tommy Kelly
44-tkls 24-solo 20-assist 4-sks 0-fum

Gerard Warren
27-tkls 21-solo 6-assist 4-sks 1-fum

Terdell Sands
23-tkls 16-solo 7-assist 2-sks 0-fum

Derrick Burgess 15-tkls 9-solo 6-assist 2-sks 1-fum

What rookey would have changed this unit....Their #s are not impressive....Would Glenn Dorsey or Sedrick Ellis have been able to stop the beeding in this run "D" as rookies...Would Vernon Gholston or Jake Long vastly improve our pass-rush this year....

Look back to what I posted before the draft and the point I made was that it takes 2-3 seasons for a "DT"-"DE" to develop....They are "NOT" a "Quick-Fix" as rookies...History makes that very clear...I will say that Glenn Dorsey is doing better than most in his role with "KC" but we were not going after him anyway...It was Chris Long...

Chris Long 35-tkls 28-solo 7-assist 4-sks 1-fum

Sorry NYRaider I was on the wrong page...Criss long brakes with tridition...He is doing very well...

PantyRaider...Lookin Back!!!!/_

6:42 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Ole panty inabunch

So this is how you try and retain some credibility? By singing a sad song about how tough you got it? Wow, that really pits you head and shoulders above everyone else. Everyone now.. a moment of silence for poor ole panty. I could tell you stories, but I don't, I keep it to football and if you keep it to football, we all can see that you don't know what the hell you are talking about. Or even understanding what you are writing about with your beatnik style.

I'm sure we could all tell our stories panty, but once again your arrogance shows through with your thinking that your stories will make us shit ourselves. You are a legend in your own mind. You and Blanda may fool the fools but you both have never fooled me.


7:38 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Damn, this thing filled up quick.
A couple of points:

1 - Al is not loosing on purpose. That is just a stupid statement. No matter what his plans, everything is worth more if the team is winning.

2 - I didn't mind the fake call. I give Jano a 50/50 shot at it if he doesn't botch the play and leave early. At a minimum, we atleast don't give up the TD if they execute the pitch w/o a fumble. Everyone would have been like "Cable's the Man!" if it had worked anyway.


8:26 AM  
Blogger nyraider said...

Whether the fake worked or not, it is probably the dumbest call I've seen in years.

Why would we need to fake a FG in a tie game against the Chiefs? The FG would have given us the lead.

Janikowski can't run 17 yards with a football. Plus, why risk injury to your kicker?

If he had made it, I would have felt relief, but still thought it was dumb. As it turns out, it was dumber than dumb.

9:31 AM  
Blogger Raider Take said...

Jones, PantyRaider is a Raider Take Hall of Famer. He has earned his latitude. Let's not cannibalize each other in here.

Moshbucket, I'd put the odds on Jano running 17 yards in that situation at 1/100. Literally. The slowest guy on the roster is going to scamper untouched for 17 yards? No way. I honestly believe that Cable lost track of the yards remaining for a first down. 4th and 2? Maybe. 4th and 10? Insane.

Now, if Jano was playing QB for the Chiefs against the Raiders in Oakland, then I might put the odds of him scampering 17 yards untouched at 50/50.

10:14 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Panty is a hall of famer, lol. Did he get in for writing in a ridiculous style? Couldn't be from the substance of his posts, everything he says is wrong. Same with Blanda and his fairytale take on the Raiders. I used to post under anon , this was before calling out Al Davis was the norm.

I was raked on the coals by these 2 for calling out their fairytale, they called me all sorts of names. I started to post my name at the bottom so they couldn't accuse me of being a troll.

So now the shoe is on the other foot, their B.S was proven as B.S. So...if they couldn't see it coming when I was seeing it for years, who has the credibilty? Not them, they have shown their opinions are WAY OFF. Who will take their take as anything more than babble?


12:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Panty said, "Would Vernon Gholston or Jake Long vastly improve our pass-rush this year...."

I, again, would like to correct the thought that Jake Long is on the defensive line. He is an Offensive Tackle (on the left-side), so no he would not improve our pass rush. Jake Long would have vastly improved our offensive line, and again, I say I would rather have him than McFadden if we had the choice. But since the Dolphins grabbed him with the first pick; we took the best player at the spot; so no complaints here.

But we can debate whether our pass rush needs help, or we just need to package some blitzes together more consistently on 3rd downs?

Now I will argue that McFadden hasn't faired much better than the others Panty listed (Gholston, Dorsey, and Ellis).

1:09 PM  
Blogger Raider Take said...

Raider Nate, you might rather have your eyes washed out with Clorox, but in case you're still considering watching the Texans game in person, I've got a pair of tickets that I'm willing to give up at a nice price. No pressure, just FYI.

1:48 PM  
Blogger Doobie said...

Sounds like we could use a little humor here.

From yesterday's WSJ "Best of the Web":

• "Kiffin Introduced as UT Coach; Will Make $2 Million in 2009"--headline, Knoxville (Tenn.) News-Sentinel, Dec. 1

• "University of Tennessee buildings will be colder this winter and warmer next spring as UT aims to cut its annual energy bill by $2 million."--Knoxville News-Sentinel, Dec. 2

2:34 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

What about him excites you over "McFab" this year and what could he have done to improve our "D" this season????....

Considering Al never trades down (a move down and then drafting Clady would have been our best 20/20 hindsite pick, IMO) I was very very very much for Al to take Dorsey.

We lost how many games this year because our defense was gassed because we have no DEPTH on our D-line???

I don't think its a stretch to say at least two, and maybe even three.

That would be kinda nice right now... 6-7 and one game out of first?

4:42 PM  
Blogger Calico Jack said...


I appreciate the fact that you are a regular visitor to RT, have football based opinions, and finally sign your name on the dotted line.

However, I don't appreciate your harsh words for PantyRaider. PantyRaider is a humorous, fun loving, diehard Raider fan. Although I don't agree with his viewpoints, I never question whether his heart is in the right place. Any guy who is dedicated enough to follow the Raiders while in Thailand is ok in my book. Enough of the petty, childish namecalling. I for one would respect you more if you toned down your negativity towards other RT visitors.


I disagree 100% with your assessment of the fake field goal. The fake field goal trick play was ridiculously flawed from a design standpoint.

* If the play was executed perfectly, SeaBass would be lucky to run 10 yards before being tackled. 7 of those 10 yards would be a net gain of 3 yards. To go 17 yards with his footspeed is a complete joke.

* The down, distance, clock, score, and field position are the key factors. The game is 3 to 3 in the 2nd quarter. A 42 yard FG gives us the lead plus positive momentum. 4 and 10 where a slow ass kicker has to run 17 yards has ZERO chance to succeed.

I agree that Davis is not losing on purpose. I don't doubt for a second that in his own twisted, delusional mind that he thinks he is doing everything he can to put the Raiders in a position to succeed. The problem I have with Davis is that he is too stubborn and distrustful to realize he needs help from a footabll operational and personnel evaluation standpoint. This is a major blindspot which could be easily remedied by hiring an executive GM to shoulder the load.

Gary: You are exactly right about Clady who would have been a PERFECT fit for the ZBS. I still think McF has a very high ceiling. I would love to see McF get 20+ touches a game for the remaining 4 games.

7:26 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

RT, I'd PERSONALLY return those tickets to that EMBESILE AL DAVIS. And tell him to stick them up his ASS!!!


8:09 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I believe the Texans game will be the crowning glory for our 08 season. We have yet to beat this team...Ever! and will be a longshot to win....I expect the show will be all that its billed to be....My last home game for the forseeable future...I will go and I will have fun with friends and family for this is a mark....a low mark as a fan....Oh well if Mr Weekend at Bernies cares not..............Nor do I!

8:38 PM  
Blogger PantyRaider said...


I'm returning the 10th if the airport stays open and would like to have a ticket for our last loosing home game....Will let you know for sure next week if you still have the tickets....So why do I want to punish myself this way...Good question...

Thanks for the support from posters on this site...I love this place dispite what our team is doing on the field or front office...I think at this point we are all a little down and have a hard time seeing any positives...

As for "JONES" he should change his handle to "Roger DangerField"..."I Get No Respect"..."Mr Negativity" strikes again..."Tooo-Chey"....Whoops!!!....Stuck himself in his own ass....As I go off laughin Again-n-Again....


NYRaider corected me and I made an adjustment to my post...Sorry...I got my "Longs" mixed-up...Looking at his rookey season he could have helped our "D" but we had no chance to take him anyway...
Chris Long 35-tkls 28-solo 7-assist 4-sks 1-fum...


Unfortunately I have not been able to watch much of this season so I have no idea if the bad "D" against the run was due to an exausted "DL"...Lack of Depth...But I can look at the #s and compair what Dorsey has done for "KC"...

KC has the 32nd "D" which is below the Raiders #25 "D"...

KC is 31st against the rush compaired to the Raiders being #29...

KC is 32nd in sacks compaired to the Raiders tied at #10...

Those are the stats that I think directly reflect upon the "DL"...So I don't see how Dorsey would have made much differance for our team had we taken him....I certainly don't see any evidace of a 6-7 record...

Glenn Dorsey 32-tkls 25-solo 7-assist 1-sack 1-fumble

But without "McFab" we may not have won the first game against KC...So now "Minus" off all that "McFab" has done and show what Dorsey has done to off-set the scores in 3-4 games this year....His production is below the players we now have on the "DL"...

Kalimba Edwards
44-tkls 37-solo 7-assist 5-sack 1-fumble

Jay Richardson
40-tkls 31-solo 9-assist 2-sacks 0-fumbles

Tommy Kelly
44-tkls 24-solo 20-assist 4-sks 0-fum

Gerard Warren
27-tkls 21-solo 6-assist 4-sks 1-fum

PantyRaider...Difficult Challenge!!!/_

9:49 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

CJ, no problem, Panty and Blanda ( throw in Gary too)are the only 2+1, but if they want to continue, I have no problem with that either. So I (JONES) bury the hatchet, can they do the same?

10:12 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

News Flash!!!!!! Faidas lose big to CHARGERS ! "L T" HAS BIGGEST GAME YET AT FAIDAS EXPENSE! big al (R.) davis fires "cable guy" and makes "freddie boom boom cannon baaaalitnitwikoff" interem, interem head coach. 3-13 just binge baby, defund the "nation"....

11:51 PM  
Blogger PantyRaider said...

Early Wish-List...

Usually I don't post it until the begaining of "FA" but in view of our total "Melt-Down" I figure now is as good as any....

"WR"-w- a "SB" Ring....

Plexico "Baby"...BlurAss...

Why the hell not...A good "WR" with a total Out-ta-Lunch attitude in the middle of a play-off hunt with a team who won it all last year on his miraculas catch....Should be out of jail by than and released by the "Midgets"...We now have a #1 "WR" to add to a very good Specialist-Core on the "O"....

"Slash" Superstar...."QB-WR-RB" -w- a "Get-out-da-Jail" (I'm Free) Card....

Micheal "Dog-Man" Vick -w- da Dawgs...

We now have our back-up "QB" who can play several positions in our "O" back-field...Can you just imagine all the Failure "Trick-Plays" we will be ShowCassing in "09"...The perfect attitude to fit into an already totally "Dis-Funk-Tunnel" Oganization...

"DT" Twins -w- Suspensions....

Kevin-n-Pat "Steroid" Williams....

We now have addressed the interior of our pourous "DL"....We could add to the mix a "DE" from "NO"...Take your pick...

"DE"...Charles Grant and Will Smith..."Sus-Pen-Did-An-Ni-Ma-Tion"...

Give-em-Hell "MrD"....Their price should be lower but we can find a way to over-pay da bastards to come in and under-acheive for us....



1:30 AM  
Blogger PantyRaider said...


The only sense I can make out of the poor use of "McFab"-n-M.Bush is the posibility that all is lost so we conserve our young tallent for next season....Fear of getting them injured....Makes very little sense but that's the only posible reasoning for such stupid decissions....

PantyRaider....Confusing at Best!!!/_

1:46 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Hey coach I got a great play for tonight. When the game is tied in say the 3rd quarter have Lechler line up to punt but have him throw a bomb to a "streaking" Cornell Green who will have lined up as an elligble receiver! How could it possibly fail? What do you guys think? Is that Gold or what? Hopefully Cable reads this.


4:31 AM  
Blogger nyraider said...

Raiders 0-10 in last 10 games against the Chargers. Why do I have a bad feeling about this one? I can envision the game stats:

Janikowski 22 carries for -8 yards.
McFadden 6 carries for 52 yards 1 TD.

Russell 10-32 for 102 yards but no INTs.

Third down efficiency 1-12

If we lose, it's just a continuation of Chargers dominance over the Raiders. If we win, it's just a 3-9 team beating a 4-8 team. That's not much to get excited about.

6:27 AM  
Blogger PantyRaider said...

Well it's nice to see we all can keep a sense of humor in this discusting situation...

A "V" means we select a little lower in the draft...Maybe as low as #10....A loss means we may select a little higher than #6...Posibly at #5 or higher if KC SL or Seattle can win a game before the end of the season...As I see it either way we loose....Refreshing NO.....

PantyRaider....Count-Down....Over Yet!!!/_

7:16 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I changed my mind. Cornell Green is to obvious. Let's line up Terdell Sands instead! Yeah that's the ticket. Can't miss.


7:27 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

RT, thanks for the offer on the tickets, but I think I will pass this time; due to a few unforseen events that are changing my holidays. It's nothing bad, just a change of plans.

Also, I still think Russell will be a good QB, and the younger QB's you compared him too have a difference, consistency in what is being coached. Kiffin and Cable have been throwing different schemes, plays, and situations at him all year. Cable is trying to be creative with his play calling, but it is truly hurting the team. Creativity is not what we need when we consistently lack execution. That is my problem with Cable.

I hope you make it out and back here safely. I wouldn't mind having Plexiglass Burress on our team, as long as we have a solid #2 WR. I disagree with signing Vick, I think even if he gets out of jail next year, the Commish gives him a lifetime ban.
Outside of a new owner, a GM, and a solid Head Coach; here is my priority list:
#1-Sign Asomugah to a long-term deal (I think Chris Johnson is a good balance to Nnamdi).
#2-Left Tackle
#3-Right Tackle
#4-Wide Reciever (This is where Plexiglass and/or TJ Houshmandzadeh would be nice)
#5-Nose Tackle
#6-A Veteran Center (Matt Birk fits nicely here because the Center needs to be the Captain of the O-line).
#7-Weak-side Linebacker

7:37 AM  
Blogger PantyRaider said...


My "Wish-List" was half sarcasm and half reality....

All those guys can play and if the price is right would be an up-grade to the team...But as for "Chemistry"....Well, it can't get nuch worse anyway so....

"Why the Hell Not"....


7:50 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Panty, long term you might be right in that McF might help the team more than Dorsey, but we needed to win NOW. If you watched the games we lost after having leads, it was pretty obvious the defense simply ran out of gas. This was especially devastating because SOB relies almost entirely on the front four to win games when we have leads instead of blitzing, and they just couldn't do it. And how could they? We at one time had THREE DT's on our roster. McF really only was instrumental in one game this year, the KC game, and the way we were running over them, I think we still could have eaked out a win against them without him.

Another starter in SOB's front-four reliant defense would have been HUGE even if he got NO tackles or sacks... simply because we could have rotated better players in and kept everyone fresh late in the game... where we lost three games. That is not something even debatable... we blew three games with leads because the defense couldn't make any stops late in the game. NOT DEBATABLE.

Like I said, McF may turn out to be the better long-term fix once we get a better line, but after five years of losing, why would you think in those terms with your top five pick?

7:57 AM  
Blogger PantyRaider said...


Makes sense and as I said I did not get to see much of the games...Mostly just the Hight-Lights and that does not show anything....

As for the timing for taking a player like "McFab" who comes along once a decade....He was the very best player available at the #5 pick...Had we passed on the opertunity so as to address a deeper need on the "DL" it would most likely have cost us in the long-run....

Now we have a core to build around and if we can add to the "DL"-n-"OL" this year we will be looking very good...The other major speciality position is at "WR"...I have no idea what the draft will look like yet but at the #5-6 position I would look at the best "WR" or "DL" position depending upon who is higher rated...Either position will help us....

I'm very "Gun-Shy" about drafting for the "OL" in the 1st rd....We have not done very well here....

Mo Collins as the second pick in the 1st rd "98" was good but the rest were waisted picks....

Matt Stinchcomb "99"
Robert Gallery "04"

We have to go all the way back to Don Mosebar "83" to find another "OL" 1st rd pick so I don't think we go that rout unless it's really a can't-miss pick or the best players at the other positions are already off the board...

It's a shame that with 4 games left the only positive we can look forward to is the "09" draft and what our position will be....


8:29 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Panty... two things...

1. I hope you are right about McF being a once in a decade player, but to be honest, I don't see it. I don't see the quick burst and vision that I saw with Adrian Peterson in his rookie year... and I don't see the power that I saw in a player like Bo Jackson, nor do I see the top end speed like, well, Bo Jackson again.

I think McF will be a top 10 RB once he becomes the Raiders every down back (which might not happen because of Fargas for some odd reason, which is a different topic) but I don't see him being an LT, or AP that carries a franchise.

2. Gallery is one of the better guards in the league, and with an actual RT could become as dominating duo as Shell/Upshaw. Would bringing back a Shell/Upshaw be worth two top ranked draft picks?

I'd do it in a heart beat.

11:56 AM  
Blogger nyraider said...

Is anyone watching tonight's game in 3-D? That would be cool.

Will bad coaching by the Chargers cancel out bad coaching by the Raiders? We'll see.

Go Raiders!

2:27 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...


hey, if they use that play you suggested and it works, tom cable will be a


that was a great list of potential HC candidates available you laid out.

trouble is, we can cross most every name off the list.

cowher, spanuola, schwartz, carroll, shotthiemer, and rex ryan, are all from the defensive side of the ball.

we don't hire defensive guys as our HC, remember ?
we would rather hire a run of the mill, o-line coach than a defensive mastermind.
yes, we are that pathetic.

i understand your premise of hiring a Gm first.
but any Gm al hires will only have to have one qualification.

can al easily slip his hand underneath the backside of the mans suit jacket, and move him every which way ?

al's freak puppet show will live on i'm afraid.
our days of glory slipping further into the past.

3:44 PM  
Blogger Raider Take said...

Just try to imagine that botched fake field goal in 3-D, with Jano bending over in your face to grab the errant pigskin, and the Chiefs defender scooping it up and running you over on his way to an infamous touchdown. No thanks.

5:09 PM  

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